Okaaaay...........My husband and I are here at the computer (for the last time I hope) just about to put this order in. He wants me to make sure we have it right. My list was Tamron 17-50 2.8 / Sigma 70-200 2.8 / Sigma 530 DG Super Electronic Flash and the 7D. But then do I ALSO need this Canon EF 50mm, f1.4 USM? He's crazy! He wants to buy them all?!
You won't know if you need the EF 50mm, f1.4 USM until you need it. It is highly recommended to have a fast aperture for the ceremony. I generally have both that lens and an EF 135mm, f2L USM for use during the ceremony.
Okaaaay...........My husband and I are here at the computer (for the last time I hope) just about to put this order in. He wants me to make sure we have it right. My list was Tamron 17-50 2.8 / Sigma 70-200 2.8 / Sigma 530 DG Super Electronic Flash and the 7D. But then do I ALSO need this Canon EF 50mm, f1.4 USM? He's crazy! He wants to buy them all?!
Add an extra camera battery to the order.
I don't have the 50 f1.4, but I do have the 50 f1.8.
It's a $100 lens that works well.
If you don't want to spend the money for the f1.4, maybe get the f1.8
+1 multiple cards (I like 8g, but ymmv)
+1 on backup battery
+1 50mm lens - the 1.4 if you can spring for it, the 1.8 if not
Practice, practice, practice with whichever camera you get. My gut says you'll probably be happy with the 60d for now; the 7d is a great camera, but one of its strengths - its customizability - is also one of the things that makes it harder to learn, especially in a time crunch. If you like the articulating screen of the 60d, go for it - both cameras can take good pictures.
And practice. TONS. Take so many pictures between now and then that your hard drive is groaning under the weight of all the giggabytage. Delete, make space, and go shoot some more. Get as confident in aperture priority (Av) and manual (if possible) as you can. Learn how to set your flash so you get predictable results. Practice accurately choosing and placing a single focus point over the desired center of focus when using wide apertures (small numbers).
12:03 AM eastern standard time ......... order complete ............ after 3 days and nights of reviewing, refiguring and trying to choose well for me - AND my hubby.
Thank you, thank you, thank you ALL for your help!
I don't know if you decided to keep the 60d or exchange for a 7d but I was reading a camera mag this morning (Foto-video digitaal) which actually rated 60d higher than 7d for image quality. I had a 60d in my hands recently with a Canon EFS f2.8 17-55 lens (mine). It felt beautifully balanced and performed brilliantly.
So if you decided to keep the 60d you should feel no regrets and you'll have some extra money left for lenses, lighting, etc. The 7d has been praised often enough in Dgrin, so if you went that route instead you know you have a great camera too.
PS. By the way Ziggy53, thanks for that info on ISO for flash. I often learn something completely new from you and do again. It is obvious when you think about it but I never realized - from now on, when I am busy with flash, ISO 400 it is (or higher if I get a new camera).
DISCLAIMER!!!! PLEASE...PLEASE...PLEASE DO NOT LET MY FOLLOWING COMMENTS dampen your new found enthusiasm for photography, and God bless your supportive hubby.
You have received great technical advice here from those with more experience than I, so I won't try and add to that.
As I sit here (pressed for time, have a birthday shoot for a 90 year old an hour and half from me) I am in fear for you!
You are taking on one of the most difficult photography challenges, a wedding. Fast moving, no second chances, low light, flash, no flash, changing light temperatures, changing schedule, etc, etc.
When I read your initial post I darn near had a heart attack!
This is truly a daunting task, and I fear failure could crush your enthusiasm, and that would be a shame.
What I read was: My husband gave me a gift of flying lessons at the local airport, and my cousin is renting a 747 in three weeks to fly to Paris. He wants me to pilot the plane, I am so excited.
YOU POSTED: As far as enjoying the wedding with the family ....... that IS how I enjoy the wedding with the family. It's what I do at every wedding I go to. Take pixs. I tend to be very social. You get to talk to everyone, joke around with them and be a part of almost everything that goes on. Meet the family the best friends ...... thus, knowing the "better" shots of people. I just love it!
You will not have time to chity chat and joke around! You will be playing catch up all day long. Chimping, changing settings, changing lenses, finding shooting angles, etc, etc.
Seriously if you were here in San Jose I would come help you!
Maybe there is a Dgrin member who is near you??????
Maybe you think the bride has limited expectations, but let me caution you here. Her expectations may or may not be in line with what you deliver.
While a DLSR can produce higher quality images than a point and shoot, there is a learning curve.
The first time I took my, then, brand new DLSR out for a shoot I took hundreds of shots. When I came home all excited and viewed them on my computer I damn near cried! I had zero usable images!!!! Fortunately no one was counting on me and after my initial thoughts of jumping off a bridge I buckled down to learn what went wrong and how to fix it. I am still learning.
If at all possible I would highly recommend hiring someone with wedding experience to shoot as primary. You shoot as second. This will reduce the pressure, and allow you more time to concentrate on fewer shots, but end up with higher quality images.
For people offering up help, a lot of you sure are handing out a bunch of doom and gloom.
First off, how did anyone ever start out taking wedding photo's, if they never shot a first one?
Give her a break. She's been to weddings, she's seen wedding photos, she just might be able to pull this off.
Next, why not buy 16 gig cards?
Nothing says you need to full it up completely. I have 3 - 16 gig cards and 2 - 4 gig cards.
I have yet to full up a 16 gig card, but I shoot jpgs.
A 16 gig card in a 5DMKII will hold about 2000 jpgs.
I have no fear of running out of space.
Speaking about cards, where did the static charge fear come from?
I've used different types of cards in different cameras for over 10 years, I have never lost a card to static electricity.
This from a guy who has had static charges jump 2 inches while getting in and out of cars while holding the camera.
Yes the 50 1.4 is a better lens, but if a person can't afford one at this time, wouldn't a 50 1.8 be a good alt?
Too many saying that she can't or shouldn't instead of giving her help and ideas.
Trying going with something positive.
My little rant is over.
Good luck with the wedding.
P.S.
Don't forget about the must have shots like placing the rings of fingers, lighting candles, and of course the first kiss.
... Speaking about cards, where did the static charge fear come from?
I've used different types of cards in different cameras for over 10 years, I have never lost a card to static electricity.
This from a guy who has had static charges jump 2 inches while getting in and out of cars while holding the camera.
...
That caution was from me. My father lost an entire card to static electricity 3 (or so) years ago.
I wasn't there at the time but he described taking the card out of the camera and placing the card into his computer's built-in card reader. He heard the static "snap" and then the card would not read in his computer.
I tried the card in several different readers and back in the camera. The card was no longer recognizable to any device. I suspect the controller had taken the hit from the static change. He lost every image on the card.
"When I read your initial post I darn near had a heart attack! This is truly a daunting task, and I fear failure could crush your enthusiasm, and that would be a shame."
Sam, I realize more and more the importance of this task. I've love photography for too long. Not much would crush my enthusiasm. (sometimes I have too much) I realize I will have challenges ......... that's why I'm trying to cover as much as possible before hand. I have let my Sister/Niece know about these challenges and they smile and say, "We know you'll do great. We want you to do it." In fact, my Sister said, "Oh, you're getting too analytical about this. Just make sure you take group pixs of each table and you'll get everybody you need." No, I'm not kidding! She really said that. I realize they don't understand all that could and "does" happen on the wedding day. Even when I try to tell them they don't change their mind. They are comfortable with the fact that others will have cameras and will be taking pixs. I know to many of you this sounds crazy but some people are more simple in their desires. She only has one bridesmaid and He, one best man. In the end ............... she will have photos of her wedding that she will like. I'm confident of this. Even if I took them with my Powershot there would still be some pixs with which she would be pleased. Totally professional ..... nah ...... perfect lighting ... uh-uh. But photos of her and her new husband smiling and happy during different parts of their wedding day .... yes. I do believe this is all she's looking for. I hope to provide her with way more than that. That is my goal. I did get to shoot some of the wedding of another niece this past Summer. Went to the outside venue before the rehearsal to check it out. Then went to the rehearsal. It was a beautiful park by the Bay. Had all the shots lined up that I wanted to take but alas.......it rained from morning till night the entire day. They had to have it inside and a photographer (who offered to take it for free to get practice to move into "wedding photography") took ceremony inside shots. I shot the Bride getting ready and reception. This niece was even more simple than the current one!
"The first time I took my, then, brand new DLSR out for a shoot I took hundreds of shots. When I came home all excited and viewed them on my computer I damn near cried! I had zero usable images!!!! Fortunately no one was counting on me and after my initial thoughts of jumping off a bridge I buckled down to learn what went wrong and how to fix it. I am still learning."
You sound like a fun guy Sam ............. had me chuckling a little over your descriptions. I expect to go out and shoot my first time and to discover the same thing. Probably very few usable images ....... but we gotta start that way. I want to start. I will be shooting every day. I also have a friend from church who says, "I've had a camera in my hand almost since I was born." Majored in Photography. He's just down the street and will be a mentor for me these coming weeks.
Oh, and CannonGuy ........... we ordered the Tamron 17-50 2.8 / Sigma 70-200 2.8 / Canon 7D body / Extra battery 3 - SanDisk 8GB Extreme 60MB / Camera bag. No, I didn't order that 50mm lens. This is going to have to be enough. I can't believe I will even own these items. I've never seen my husband like this. He would NOT even negotiate with me when I told him it was too much. So generous of him.........
.......... and Davev, love your attitude. I've got all the "must have" shots already listed.
Do not want to bring a damper on things with this wedding just around the corner.....but along with listing all the MUST HAVE shots...do you know how to get the pose, including the dress, hands and such......PM me your actual email and I will find and email my wedding shot list that includes the actual pose descriptions for most.......If you are going to have to work off a printed list, then have your hubby or other family member of friend to keep track of the list and to help keep it moving............
Technical caveat with the 7d: don't try to use wide open apertures and let it pick its own focus points. Set it to single focus point (not auto or zone) and make sure YOU decide which one to use, and place it over whatever you want to be in sharp focus. This is particularly important at wide (small number) apertures!!!
As mentioned above, it's a superb machine, but it's complex and takes some getting used to. The auto exposure modes will be fine (Av will be your friend if you're not comfortable shooting manual), but the AF assumes the photographer will take charge of it - if you leave it to the camera, in situations where there is critical depth of field, it may not focus where you intend and the shots will be useless. Really, REALLY take the time to figure out the AF settings - this means a long afternoon with the manual, and a lot of really bad practice shots. You'll be glad you took the time
I will be shooting every day. I also have a friend from church who says, "I've had a camera in my hand almost since I was born." Majored in Photography. He's just down the street and will be a mentor for me these coming weeks.
This is good news!
Now that I have had my say about the wisdom of this project so soon after acquiring the newfangled gear I will give you my thought on how to get the best results.
My first thought would be to write down a list of what you need to learn in order of importance. Prioritize and don't make the list too long.
Learn how to use the histogram. Do not rely on how the LCD display looks. Expose to the right and if shooting RAW small amounts of blinkies are OK.
Use the LCD to determine over all composition and if the subject is sharp and in focus. Do not set your LCD brightness level at the highest setting. It will make your images look to be over exposed and mess with your mind.
My basics for event / wedding shooting ( without flash) is to use aperture priority and adjust ISO and aperture to obtain a shutter speed fast enough to hopefully ensure a clean shot without camera shake. The shutter speed your trying to get will vary based on the lens focal length, with or without IS and will vary by individual. General rule of thumb is 1/XXX where XXX is the lens focal length. IE: using a 100mm lens I would try for 1/100 or faster. properly used IS can reduce this by a stop or two, again depending on the individual. Only practice and experience will let you know what you need.
Be careful with your focus when shooting wide open. Generally a lens is sharper stopped down one or two stops. Use your ISO settings, 800 and 1600 are more than common in low light. A sharp image with noise is better than a fuzzy image without noise.
When using IS you need to compose your shot, half press the shutter button to get focus and hold this for a half second to one second. You should be able to see the focus point stabilize. Then shoot. Learn to press the shutter button softly like your a sniper shooting a target at 1500 meters. This will keep camera shake down, but can not do anything about subject movement. The faster your subjects are moving the faster you need the shutter speed to be.
Did you buy the speed light? If so you need to learn how to use it. I don't recommend using the on camera flash.
What type of processing software do you have? Did you buy more than one memory card?
I would recommend not trying to make a long shot list. You want to focus on the event not a list. Nothing will go as planed. People may or may not be cooperative.
I believe 30 good images are far better than 800 crap photos, so I would concentrate my efforts in that direction. Basically work on getting good quality shots and don't worry about getting every shot possible.
I'm new to all this digital stuff but am gonna throw in my 2 cents. Years ago while still shooting my old Canon AE-1 my father and 2nd wife to be asked me to take pictures of their small wedding. They were trying to keep the whole thing small. I warned them but they said they really wanted me to do it. I went ahead as an amature and did it and they ended up being very pleased with the results. No way were they the full on paid pro's kind of thing. My father passed a few years ago and my step mother still has some of those shots up in the house. Learn your camera, maybe look at some books on wedding photography, make a list of things you want to get shots of and good luck!!!!!
I didn't read all of this thread, so maybe it is mentioned elsewhere, but I'm not too fond of the 55-250mm as the sole lens choice on this crop body. Seems tight. You may want to have another wider lens available for group shots and interiors. You could rent one or more good quality lenses, but give yourself enough time to practice with them, especially in low light. Practice with your flash, as well. Learn as much as much as you can about the church and reception hall. How high are the ceilings, what color are they, and the walls (hopefully white so you can bounce off them). You may want to get a flash diffuser, or build your own. But practice, practice, practice.
Oh, and when you practice in low light, make sure you are taking pictures of people or animals that move, not just static scenes.
I'm new to all this digital stuff but am gonna throw in my 2 cents. Years ago while still shooting my old Canon AE-1 my father and 2nd wife to be asked me to take pictures of their small wedding. They were trying to keep the whole thing small. I warned them but they said they really wanted me to do it. I went ahead as an amature and did it and they ended up being very pleased with the results. No way were they the full on paid pro's kind of thing. My father passed a few years ago and my step mother still has some of those shots up in the house. Learn your camera, maybe look at some books on wedding photography, make a list of things you want to get shots of and good luck!!!!!
I am glad it worked for you. I shot my brother-in-laws wedding years ago and screwed up big time. This was in the days when you had to be careful about synchronizing flash and half my shots in the late evening ended up half black - too much champagne I think. Difficult to be part of the party and doing a professional job at the same time. Not impossible but difficult, at least for me.
DISCLAIMER!!!! PLEASE...PLEASE...PLEASE DO NOT LET MY FOLLOWING COMMENTS dampen your new found enthusiasm for photography, and God bless your supportive hubby.
You have received great technical advice here from those with more experience than I, so I won't try and add to that.
As I sit here (pressed for time, have a birthday shoot for a 90 year old an hour and half from me) I am in fear for you!
You are taking on one of the most difficult photography challenges, a wedding. Fast moving, no second chances, low light, flash, no flash, changing light temperatures, changing schedule, etc, etc.
When I read your initial post I darn near had a heart attack!
This is truly a daunting task, and I fear failure could crush your enthusiasm, and that would be a shame.
What I read was: My husband gave me a gift of flying lessons at the local airport, and my cousin is renting a 747 in three weeks to fly to Paris. He wants me to pilot the plane, I am so excited.
YOU POSTED: As far as enjoying the wedding with the family ....... that IS how I enjoy the wedding with the family. It's what I do at every wedding I go to. Take pixs. I tend to be very social. You get to talk to everyone, joke around with them and be a part of almost everything that goes on. Meet the family the best friends ...... thus, knowing the "better" shots of people. I just love it!
You will not have time to chity chat and joke around! You will be playing catch up all day long. Chimping, changing settings, changing lenses, finding shooting angles, etc, etc.
Seriously if you were here in San Jose I would come help you!
Maybe there is a Dgrin member who is near you??????
Maybe you think the bride has limited expectations, but let me caution you here. Her expectations may or may not be in line with what you deliver.
While a DLSR can produce higher quality images than a point and shoot, there is a learning curve.
The first time I took my, then, brand new DLSR out for a shoot I took hundreds of shots. When I came home all excited and viewed them on my computer I damn near cried! I had zero usable images!!!! Fortunately no one was counting on me and after my initial thoughts of jumping off a bridge I buckled down to learn what went wrong and how to fix it. I am still learning.
If at all possible I would highly recommend hiring someone with wedding experience to shoot as primary. You shoot as second. This will reduce the pressure, and allow you more time to concentrate on fewer shots, but end up with higher quality images.
Good luck,
Sam
like as always great advice
i"ll send private message please check it, sam
canon EOS 7D /canon 5d mark ll/ EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II USM/EF-S 10-22mm f/3.5-4.5 USM/ canon lens 85mm 1.8
Oh, I just noticed some of you asked how the wedding was ...... before I could report back! Yep, I WAS sorting thru all the photos after still visiting with the family in Indiana. It was "glorious"........ with tons of learning (still searching for the best place to take a photography course. Any suggestions?) accompanied, of course with a new and different anxiety each day of the week's event. I loved it ....... just loved it though! But I must say, the processing time afterwards is "quite involved". That was new to me. I'm still not sure how to post specific photos here but I think you can go to my wall (is that what you call it) and see the Roswog - Miller pre-wedding, wedding and reception photos. Because it was family I posted the whole process. We all really got closer through this experience. Night after night at my Sister's house (hogging the computer) studying and editing the shots of the day. Her husband got to joking, "Mel, I haven't been able to use my computer for three nights in a row!"They were all very pleased with the pictures. Myself? I had to do a LOT of editing for darkness, sharpness, etc. but there always has to be a first time. I wonder what it would have been like if I hadn't shot in the RAW. (By the way, LEARNING about transferring RAW to Jpeg was quite the experience) I REALLY want to learn about the ISO and aperture, etc. now. It will be a whole new world for me. I did want to tell you all that I copied MANY of your suggestions and notes and took them with me in a file. I often referred back to them ...... over and over to try to remember all that was said. Then I would compare that to the camera manual as I reviewed the shots taken that day and all their statistics. The night after the rehearsal dinner I stayed up reviewing and studying from 9:00 to 1:00 to make sure I could get the most important things down in my head. Made a little cheat sheet to have with me the next day. The main "scary moment" was right after the minister pronounced them Man and Wife. Right then, I accidentally pushed the "timer" button instead of "continuous mode" for shooting the couple coming down the isle. Tried to stay calm - not panic - think straight - and QUICKLY figure out why the camera was flashing a blinking light and wouldn't snap the pix????? By the time they walked through the door I had figured out what had happened. I was just ever so grateful (and blessed) that it happened at the end of the wedding. Fortunately there was another good friend of their's who was also shooting them coming down the isle. The other disappointment to me was the formal shots afterwards of the group. They were in a BIG hurry as was expected. I took from an angle a couple of times and the people in the back are blurred. Even editing couldn't bring them into sharper focus. Alas......... Another thing, I had my other powershot S5 camera in my bag during the reception. Towards the end when we were all still dancing my Sisters and I would grab it and snap another pix. Then all of a sudden I got "lens error" in the LCD panel. That was the end of that camera for the night. Just like you guys told me, camera's break. I was greatly blessed for by mishaps to have happened at less crucial times. I'm sending it off to have it repaired. I noticed that many have complained about this very issue online. First time it happened for me. The pixs are fair compared to the beautiful ones here on this site but we're all very content.
Thanks again and again for all your input into my little journey!!
Oh!! And the flash .......... that's a whole nother area that I need to practice with. I couldn't get down how to eliminate shadows at the reception especially. I mostly kept the swivel up to the ceiling but often tried different angles. Definitely need practice with that!
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Matthew SavilleRegistered Users, Retired ModPosts: 3,352Major grins
edited March 14, 2011
I'm sorry but I have to agree with Sam on this one. Reading the questions being asked, and reading the mish-mash of advice given, well, honestly I wish I could reach through my computer and smack a few people. Plain and simple, a $1700 investment doesn't qualify someone to shoot a wedding. I know we all KNOW that, but in my opinion that fact only sank in about 90%. If you don't have thick skin you don't need to bother reading the rest of this, just know that I think a few hundred of that $1700 should have been spent on an experienced 2nd shooter; that's the bottom line.
Melodina, I hope that accidentally bumping your camera into timer mode right before the wedding kiss was enough of a smack / wake-up call. Or if I misread and you DID NOT miss the wedding kiss, ...imagine if it HAD been that moment!
Okay, I hope I've gotten the rudeness out of my system, I'm very sorry for that but I'm just a tough love kinda guy when it comes to giving advice. And hey, the couple likes the photos, so mission accomplished. But I will say, you absolutely should have taken $300 or so of that camera fund, and hired an experienced 2nd shooter. If you did, then I apologize for being harsh on you. But if you shot it solo, then you took a HUGE risk with the bride and groom's wedding photos by simply buying a bunch of new gear and trying to cover everything yourself. Especially a brand new camera with hundreds of functions and operations.
I would scold the rest of you for offering confusing or bad advice, but I can already see the rotten tomatoes flying my direction so I will just say, please don't give advice on shooting a wedding unless you've shot MANY of them yourself. It doesn't matter that much what size cards you have, or the exact aperture of your lens, or this or that. What REALLY matters is, having enough experience to KNOW that your equipment, and your procedure, SIMPLY WORKS and won't let you down. For example I would rather have an f/1.8 lens and a years' worth of experience shooting (autofocus, exposure) in low light, than an f/1.4 or f/1.2 lens and minimal experience. Anyways no amount of internet advice is going to create the wisdom of experience, unless of course the internet advice IS to go out and gain that experience. Which, thankfully, many people did encourage.
Some of you say "lay off her, EVERYBODY has their first time!" and I totally agree with that. However, why not get someone with LOTS of experience to 2nd shoot for your first few gigs at least? Why not assist a few other photographers for a few jobs, too?
Yes, it's hard to find 2nd shooter work and it's hard to find others who will assist a beginner. But if you truly care about the couple's photos turning out okay, it's not that much effort.
Now, on a positive note:
Melodina, clearly you totally enjoyed the experience, and you earnestly dedicated yourself to making things work out. I'm VERY proud of you for staying up late, studying, making notes, seeking advice and listening to it, etc. It sounds like you will make a very good wedding photographer, in the long run. Please just do the brides out there a favor and find someone you can study with, work with, and learn from in real-time. Online help / advice is totally dwarfed by in-person, hands-on learning and experience, and you owe it to your future brides / clients to be a responsible, reliable professional. Even if you're a hobbyist shooting weddings for friends, the results still need to have a high standard of excellence.
Well Matt ........... as always I thank you for even responding. I expect to receive some tough advice. The only way to keep going is to pay attention to the good and bad. You gotta remember though, my Sister wouldn't hire a 2nd shooter. And sorry, "I'm" not going to hire one! I didn't get paid myself? Oh, but in reality ....... I did in so many different ways. I do know of some photographers that do a lot of weddings for members of our church in this area. I've thought about asking them if I could 2nd shoot with them sometime. And thanks, too, for the positive note.
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Matthew SavilleRegistered Users, Retired ModPosts: 3,352Major grins
Well Matt ........... as always I thank you for even responding. I expect to receive some tough advice. The only way to keep going is to pay attention to the good and bad. You gotta remember though, my Sister wouldn't hire a 2nd shooter. And sorry, "I'm" not going to hire one! I didn't get paid myself? Oh, but in reality ....... I did in so many different ways. I do know of some photographers that do a lot of weddings for members of our church in this area. I've thought about asking them if I could 2nd shoot with them sometime. And thanks, too, for the positive note.
I'm glad you're open-minded. Honestly the best way to get better is to be brutal on yourself and always step up your game. And, be as prepared as possible for anything. The good thing is, it doesn't take an actual wedding to get REALLY good at your portraiture skills, nor your timing / candid skills, flash skills, etc. :-)
Comments
You won't know if you need the EF 50mm, f1.4 USM until you need it. It is highly recommended to have a fast aperture for the ceremony. I generally have both that lens and an EF 135mm, f2L USM for use during the ceremony.
(Don't ask him for the 135L right away however.
Moderator of the Cameras and Accessories forums
Add an extra camera battery to the order.
I don't have the 50 f1.4, but I do have the 50 f1.8.
It's a $100 lens that works well.
If you don't want to spend the money for the f1.4, maybe get the f1.8
Good luck.
Basking in the shadows of yesterday's triumphs'.
And do throw in at least one extra battery. Or two.
+1 on backup battery
+1 50mm lens - the 1.4 if you can spring for it, the 1.8 if not
Practice, practice, practice with whichever camera you get. My gut says you'll probably be happy with the 60d for now; the 7d is a great camera, but one of its strengths - its customizability - is also one of the things that makes it harder to learn, especially in a time crunch. If you like the articulating screen of the 60d, go for it - both cameras can take good pictures.
And practice. TONS. Take so many pictures between now and then that your hard drive is groaning under the weight of all the giggabytage. Delete, make space, and go shoot some more. Get as confident in aperture priority (Av) and manual (if possible) as you can. Learn how to set your flash so you get predictable results. Practice accurately choosing and placing a single focus point over the desired center of focus when using wide apertures (small numbers).
Best of luck!
Thank you, thank you, thank you ALL for your help!
I don't know if you decided to keep the 60d or exchange for a 7d but I was reading a camera mag this morning (Foto-video digitaal) which actually rated 60d higher than 7d for image quality. I had a 60d in my hands recently with a Canon EFS f2.8 17-55 lens (mine). It felt beautifully balanced and performed brilliantly.
So if you decided to keep the 60d you should feel no regrets and you'll have some extra money left for lenses, lighting, etc. The 7d has been praised often enough in Dgrin, so if you went that route instead you know you have a great camera too.
PS. By the way Ziggy53, thanks for that info on ISO for flash. I often learn something completely new from you and do again. It is obvious when you think about it but I never realized - from now on, when I am busy with flash, ISO 400 it is (or higher if I get a new camera).
DISCLAIMER!!!! PLEASE...PLEASE...PLEASE DO NOT LET MY FOLLOWING COMMENTS dampen your new found enthusiasm for photography, and God bless your supportive hubby.
You have received great technical advice here from those with more experience than I, so I won't try and add to that.
As I sit here (pressed for time, have a birthday shoot for a 90 year old an hour and half from me) I am in fear for you!
You are taking on one of the most difficult photography challenges, a wedding. Fast moving, no second chances, low light, flash, no flash, changing light temperatures, changing schedule, etc, etc.
When I read your initial post I darn near had a heart attack!
This is truly a daunting task, and I fear failure could crush your enthusiasm, and that would be a shame.
What I read was: My husband gave me a gift of flying lessons at the local airport, and my cousin is renting a 747 in three weeks to fly to Paris. He wants me to pilot the plane, I am so excited.
YOU POSTED:
As far as enjoying the wedding with the family ....... that IS how I enjoy the wedding with the family. It's what I do at every wedding I go to. Take pixs. I tend to be very social. You get to talk to everyone, joke around with them and be a part of almost everything that goes on. Meet the family the best friends ...... thus, knowing the "better" shots of people. I just love it!
You will not have time to chity chat and joke around! You will be playing catch up all day long. Chimping, changing settings, changing lenses, finding shooting angles, etc, etc.
Seriously if you were here in San Jose I would come help you!
Maybe there is a Dgrin member who is near you??????
Maybe you think the bride has limited expectations, but let me caution you here. Her expectations may or may not be in line with what you deliver.
While a DLSR can produce higher quality images than a point and shoot, there is a learning curve.
The first time I took my, then, brand new DLSR out for a shoot I took hundreds of shots. When I came home all excited and viewed them on my computer I damn near cried! I had zero usable images!!!! Fortunately no one was counting on me and after my initial thoughts of jumping off a bridge I buckled down to learn what went wrong and how to fix it. I am still learning.
If at all possible I would highly recommend hiring someone with wedding experience to shoot as primary. You shoot as second. This will reduce the pressure, and allow you more time to concentrate on fewer shots, but end up with higher quality images.
Good luck,
Sam
First off, how did anyone ever start out taking wedding photo's, if they never shot a first one?
Give her a break. She's been to weddings, she's seen wedding photos, she just might be able to pull this off.
Next, why not buy 16 gig cards?
Nothing says you need to full it up completely. I have 3 - 16 gig cards and 2 - 4 gig cards.
I have yet to full up a 16 gig card, but I shoot jpgs.
A 16 gig card in a 5DMKII will hold about 2000 jpgs.
I have no fear of running out of space.
Speaking about cards, where did the static charge fear come from?
I've used different types of cards in different cameras for over 10 years, I have never lost a card to static electricity.
This from a guy who has had static charges jump 2 inches while getting in and out of cars while holding the camera.
Yes the 50 1.4 is a better lens, but if a person can't afford one at this time, wouldn't a 50 1.8 be a good alt?
Too many saying that she can't or shouldn't instead of giving her help and ideas.
Trying going with something positive.
My little rant is over.
Good luck with the wedding.
P.S.
Don't forget about the must have shots like placing the rings of fingers, lighting candles, and of course the first kiss.
Basking in the shadows of yesterday's triumphs'.
That caution was from me. My father lost an entire card to static electricity 3 (or so) years ago.
I wasn't there at the time but he described taking the card out of the camera and placing the card into his computer's built-in card reader. He heard the static "snap" and then the card would not read in his computer.
I tried the card in several different readers and back in the camera. The card was no longer recognizable to any device. I suspect the controller had taken the hit from the static change. He lost every image on the card.
Moderator of the Cameras and Accessories forums
Do not want to bring a damper on things with this wedding just around the corner.....but along with listing all the MUST HAVE shots...do you know how to get the pose, including the dress, hands and such......PM me your actual email and I will find and email my wedding shot list that includes the actual pose descriptions for most.......If you are going to have to work off a printed list, then have your hubby or other family member of friend to keep track of the list and to help keep it moving............
As mentioned above, it's a superb machine, but it's complex and takes some getting used to. The auto exposure modes will be fine (Av will be your friend if you're not comfortable shooting manual), but the AF assumes the photographer will take charge of it - if you leave it to the camera, in situations where there is critical depth of field, it may not focus where you intend and the shots will be useless. Really, REALLY take the time to figure out the AF settings - this means a long afternoon with the manual, and a lot of really bad practice shots. You'll be glad you took the time
I will be shooting every day. I also have a friend from church who says, "I've had a camera in my hand almost since I was born." Majored in Photography. He's just down the street and will be a mentor for me these coming weeks.
This is good news!
Now that I have had my say about the wisdom of this project so soon after acquiring the newfangled gear I will give you my thought on how to get the best results.
My first thought would be to write down a list of what you need to learn in order of importance. Prioritize and don't make the list too long.
Learn how to use the histogram. Do not rely on how the LCD display looks. Expose to the right and if shooting RAW small amounts of blinkies are OK.
Use the LCD to determine over all composition and if the subject is sharp and in focus. Do not set your LCD brightness level at the highest setting. It will make your images look to be over exposed and mess with your mind.
My basics for event / wedding shooting ( without flash) is to use aperture priority and adjust ISO and aperture to obtain a shutter speed fast enough to hopefully ensure a clean shot without camera shake. The shutter speed your trying to get will vary based on the lens focal length, with or without IS and will vary by individual. General rule of thumb is 1/XXX where XXX is the lens focal length. IE: using a 100mm lens I would try for 1/100 or faster. properly used IS can reduce this by a stop or two, again depending on the individual. Only practice and experience will let you know what you need.
Be careful with your focus when shooting wide open. Generally a lens is sharper stopped down one or two stops. Use your ISO settings, 800 and 1600 are more than common in low light. A sharp image with noise is better than a fuzzy image without noise.
When using IS you need to compose your shot, half press the shutter button to get focus and hold this for a half second to one second. You should be able to see the focus point stabilize. Then shoot. Learn to press the shutter button softly like your a sniper shooting a target at 1500 meters. This will keep camera shake down, but can not do anything about subject movement. The faster your subjects are moving the faster you need the shutter speed to be.
Did you buy the speed light? If so you need to learn how to use it. I don't recommend using the on camera flash.
What type of processing software do you have? Did you buy more than one memory card?
I would recommend not trying to make a long shot list. You want to focus on the event not a list. Nothing will go as planed. People may or may not be cooperative.
I believe 30 good images are far better than 800 crap photos, so I would concentrate my efforts in that direction. Basically work on getting good quality shots and don't worry about getting every shot possible.
Hope this makes some sense.
Sam
Oh, and when you practice in low light, make sure you are taking pictures of people or animals that move, not just static scenes.
I am glad it worked for you. I shot my brother-in-laws wedding years ago and screwed up big time. This was in the days when you had to be careful about synchronizing flash and half my shots in the late evening ended up half black - too much champagne I think. Difficult to be part of the party and doing a professional job at the same time. Not impossible but difficult, at least for me.
like as always great advice
i"ll send private message please check it, sam
http://www.stephaniefaith.com
A migraine
Thanks again and again for all your input into my little journey!!
Melodina, I hope that accidentally bumping your camera into timer mode right before the wedding kiss was enough of a smack / wake-up call. Or if I misread and you DID NOT miss the wedding kiss, ...imagine if it HAD been that moment!
Okay, I hope I've gotten the rudeness out of my system, I'm very sorry for that but I'm just a tough love kinda guy when it comes to giving advice. And hey, the couple likes the photos, so mission accomplished. But I will say, you absolutely should have taken $300 or so of that camera fund, and hired an experienced 2nd shooter. If you did, then I apologize for being harsh on you. But if you shot it solo, then you took a HUGE risk with the bride and groom's wedding photos by simply buying a bunch of new gear and trying to cover everything yourself. Especially a brand new camera with hundreds of functions and operations.
I would scold the rest of you for offering confusing or bad advice, but I can already see the rotten tomatoes flying my direction so I will just say, please don't give advice on shooting a wedding unless you've shot MANY of them yourself. It doesn't matter that much what size cards you have, or the exact aperture of your lens, or this or that. What REALLY matters is, having enough experience to KNOW that your equipment, and your procedure, SIMPLY WORKS and won't let you down. For example I would rather have an f/1.8 lens and a years' worth of experience shooting (autofocus, exposure) in low light, than an f/1.4 or f/1.2 lens and minimal experience. Anyways no amount of internet advice is going to create the wisdom of experience, unless of course the internet advice IS to go out and gain that experience. Which, thankfully, many people did encourage.
Some of you say "lay off her, EVERYBODY has their first time!" and I totally agree with that. However, why not get someone with LOTS of experience to 2nd shoot for your first few gigs at least? Why not assist a few other photographers for a few jobs, too?
Yes, it's hard to find 2nd shooter work and it's hard to find others who will assist a beginner. But if you truly care about the couple's photos turning out okay, it's not that much effort.
Now, on a positive note:
Melodina, clearly you totally enjoyed the experience, and you earnestly dedicated yourself to making things work out. I'm VERY proud of you for staying up late, studying, making notes, seeking advice and listening to it, etc. It sounds like you will make a very good wedding photographer, in the long run. Please just do the brides out there a favor and find someone you can study with, work with, and learn from in real-time. Online help / advice is totally dwarfed by in-person, hands-on learning and experience, and you owe it to your future brides / clients to be a responsible, reliable professional. Even if you're a hobbyist shooting weddings for friends, the results still need to have a high standard of excellence.
Take care,
=Matt=
My SmugMug Portfolio • My Astro-Landscape Photo Blog • Dgrin Weddings Forum
No tomatoes from me... however, you should put your UV filter on so you don't get tomato in your camera.
=Matt=
My SmugMug Portfolio • My Astro-Landscape Photo Blog • Dgrin Weddings Forum