FWIW I like having the download button at a nice easily describable position on the screen - bottom right - thank you. Trying to describe how to download photos at the moment is a little painful for those who don't automatically just 'get it' so that is a good improvement. If you decide to move that button can you keep it somewhere that is easily describable as describing the icon itself is a little tough
Loss of HTML in gallery descriptions and captions is going to bust a number of sites in ways that may not ever be fixable on Smugmug. It feels like you don't have a good sense of what creative things people have used this for.
Calling our custom HTML "page busting HTML" sets a tone that your customers are destroying their pages and they can't be trusted. Yes, some people screw up their pages by putting bad HTML in it (I've helped countless ones on dgrin). But, do you punish the entire customer base by taking away powerful tools just because some people mess it up. Why don't you do like blogs do and check the user HTML for the obvious things like mismatched div tags? This is a huge step backwards for many to lose the ability to put HTML in these fields. Why take this capability away? If SM is turning into a site on training wheels where you can't possibly make a mistake and thus you can no longer customize any way you want with your own HTML, then I may be looking around for other options. It's the very freedom to do anything I can code with JS, CSS or HTML that has kept me from leaving. I know I'm not the majority of the market, but if you want people like me around (for our beneficial effect on the rest of the community), you need this capability. I have no issue with you offering tools that makes it less likely that you need to resort to your own HTML (like easy customizer), but why prohibit custom HTML? I know of several SM sites that will simply be ruined without custom HTML and will be hundreds of hours of work to convert to some other scheme.
I 100% agree witih jfriend on this issue. There a lot of us who have found very creative and valuable ways of using gallery descriptions. Take a look at how CSS and HTML is used to create value for my customers so that they can quickly find their photos: http://www.mikejulianaphotography.com/SkiRacing/2011-Season
Note that this is done at both the gallery and sub-category using HTML and CSS. This feature differentiates me in the market and I've received lots of feedback on this ability. I spent a lot of time getting this working. Under the "new" feature set, how will I be able to do this?
How will we add Paypal functionality to our sites? I typically do this in the gallery description as well.
Again, the ability to do some of these "unique" things is a huge draw for some of us. Please make sure you really understand how these" features" really enable some of your pros and please reassure us that we can accomplisth these types of things in the future.
I 100% agree witih jfriend on this issue. There a lot of us who have found very creative and valuable ways of using gallery descriptions. Take a look at how CSS and HTML is used to create value for my customers so that they can quickly find their photos: http://www.mikejulianaphotography.com/SkiRacing/2011-Season
Note that this is done at both the gallery and sub-category using HTML and CSS. This feature differentiates me in the market and I've received lots of feedback on this ability. I spent a lot of time getting this working. Under the "new" feature set, how will I be able to do this?
How will we add Paypal functionality to our sites? I typically do this in the gallery description as well.
Again, the ability to do some of these "unique" things is a huge draw for some of us. Please make sure you really understand how these" features" really enable some of your pros and please reassure us that we can accomplisth these types of things in the future.
Those pages are excellent examples of the creativity folks have employed with their own HTML.
Since SM seem to want the "customizing album description" comments to be in a different thread, please add your additional comments on that over here rather than in this thread. We need more examples to show SM. Please post your examples of useful HTML in gallery description or captions here.
I haven't read this whole thread (and don't understand a lot of the advanced code stuff ;~). However, I do like the new, cleaned-up design. I agree with John in that we need a checkout button.
I'm not sure I understand... there will be no support for HTML-only pages? Can anyone confirm this?
I haven't read this whole thread (and don't understand a lot of the advanced code stuff ;~). However, I do like the new, cleaned-up design. I agree with John in that we need a checkout button.
I'm not sure I understand... there will be no support for HTML-only pages? Can anyone confirm this?
Originally, it was sounding like there wouldn't be. The changes and design are still in flux, though, and SmugMug is welcoming feedback, so that's a positive thing. So we don't know what the final outcome of this may be. The discussion about Html in gallery descriptions, etc. has been moved to another location so that this main thread doesn't get so full. Here it is: http://www.dgrin.com/showthread.php?p=1624347#post1624347
Originally, it was sounding like there wouldn't be. The changes and design are still in flux, though, and SmugMug is welcoming feedback, so that's a positive thing. So we don't know what the final outcome of this may be. The discussion about Html in gallery descriptions, etc. has been moved to another location so that this main thread doesn't get so full. Here it is: http://www.dgrin.com/showthread.php?p=1624347#post1624347
thanks so much for all the time you took to get this amazing feedback to us. See you Thursday! Well, I won't be there but those that truly matter in this regard will
In chrome when you hover the mouse over a video the mouse icon changes from a pointer to a magnifying glass (loup?). I'm not sure if that is deliberate or not but if it is then it is a little confusing. In 'classic' Smugmug that doesn't happen
In chrome when you hover the mouse over a video the mouse icon changes from a pointer to a magnifying glass (loup?). I'm not sure if that is deliberate or not but if it is then it is a little confusing. In 'classic' Smugmug that doesn't happen
Rich
It deliberate because clicking on the main image will open the lightbox with a larger version. Same for video and for photo. The magnifying glass is new in the new version as a visual hint that clicking on it will magnify what you're looking at.
I like the idea that new gallery styles are being worked on. The problem is it appears that only photos are taken into consideration, with a thumbnail mentality. I use SmugMug strictly for video files in password protected galleries for my clients. The thumbnail idea is less useful than a "text view" where I can add in longer filenames and descriptions. These would be able to be sorted by date or alphabetical. Currently SmugMug seems to be relying on a purely visual approach based around thumbnails.
Can we get a style worked on that is more centered around video files and the information related to them. Something that will allow my clients to find their content fast and know if they are on version 1, 2, 3 or 20
Some more video-centric features would be nice in this new 'look', I tend to think that the focus here is just appearance though.
Videos have not played in the slideshow for years while flickr has had this feature for years, and videos still do not play in the gallery, just in the lightbox. These are some needed functions that would greatly outweight any 'prettiness' imo.
I think that if SmugMug doesn't put a little more time in the video implementation I may have to look elsewhere. I really like the whole workflow if SmugMug, but my clients often complain about not being able to find their content fast enough. It stems from the cutoff file names of the video files. A new style is needed as I outlined above with much more emphasis on text rather than thumbnail. I really hope something can be done. I am willing to pay for the customization.
It deliberate because clicking on the main image will open the lightbox with a larger version. Same for video and for photo. The magnifying glass is new in the new version as a visual hint that clicking on it will magnify what you're looking at.
Thanks John. That does make sense then. I was confused because I wanted to click on the play icon in the centre of the image but felt that I couldn't 'point' at that icon because my mouse had turned into the magnifier. Of course as soon as I click on the image it works but it felt a little unnatural. On a straight photo it would have felt correct of course.
Good things:.....
Bad Things:........
For novice viewers:....
Gallery Layout Issues:....
For Site Owners:...
CSS:.....
Other........
Javascript:....
Bugs.....
John, I thank you greatly for doing such a thoughtful & thorough & well-sorted list of everything you see when looking at the new design. I hope a lot of people are reading it. (Post #150, for those who haven't) So far, I didn't find anything on your list that I wouldn't give a thumbs-up to, and I'm sure the great majority of our fellow Smuggers would as well. I pray that your voice is heard well above all the din, and I hope your visit to SmugMug goes fantastically well. I've been busy getting a daughter "married off" ( ! ) & have not had the time lately to respond much to ideas about the new design, so I'm very very grateful to some of you who have done so in a systematic way. It give me great hope that these changes will work out well in the end, and that SmugMug is trying to listen to people who are using this site every day. Good job & thank you for caring this much. To SmugMug: please give John a very good ear!
Lightbox - The close icon can barely be seen dimmed. Isn't too bad for
photos because clicking photo returns to gallery. But for videos it has to be
clicked and it's not obvious at all.
I would get rid of the X icon and add a text button "Back to gallery". Maybe
even making the text a bright color or red. Something we can customize to
our own taste. Another idea, instead of the icon use the letter X in a box,
then the text "X" can also be customized with js to say anything.
I find it very disturbing I can not choose the size for lightbox without first
going into lightbox. Then there is no obvious size picker. I don't think "auto" is
very smart, it should say "sizes", duh.
Caption oddly positioned. It's not centered. It's not aligned with anything. Any short amount of text just looks weirdly positioned.
No Keywords. Why are keywords not shown in lightbox? If this view is all about this particular image, then why can't you see keywords here.
No Exif. Why can't you see exif in the lightbox?
SmugmugPro Logo. I hope we can get rid of the SmugmugPro logo at the top of the lightbox. I don't have that anywhere on my site now and don't want it. My site isn't about Smugmug.
Cryptic Auto button. Show the button labeled "Auto" to a novice viewer and they will have no idea what it's for? The graphic is cryptic (memorable maybe after you know what it is, but not self describing to a novice viewer). There's no tooltip to tell you what it does?
No current size indicator. When you click on the Auto button, there's no way to tell what size is currently displaying. So, if you just want to make it one size larger, there's no way to do that. This is way less functional than the current design that shows you what the current size is. You MUST have an indicator for the current size.
Should be able to drag oversize image around viewport. Once you select a size that is larger than the viewport, you really ought to be able to drag the image around to see the parts that are clipped. This is very useful for examining the fine detail in a high res image. Right now if I try to do that in Chrome, the browser "selects" the image (making it blue) and rendering it impossible to view any more.
Inconsistent size buttons. The Auto and Share buttons are not the same size as the Like button.
Where's download? Shouldn't there be a download button in the lightbox that would let you download any specific size that is available for viewing (if image is not protected).
Where's comment? How does one initiate an image or view an comment from the lightbox view? Is this just gone now?
Where are numbers? Why did we lose numbers in the lightbox navigation that tell you where you are in the gallery?
FB button flashes. Once again, the FB button flashes as we go from one image to the next.
No keyboard shortcut for close. You can keyboard navigation in the lightbox with left/right arrow, but you can't close the lightbox with the keyboard. Shouldn't Escape or Return close the lightbox?
Not used to Auto-dimming. I'm having a hard time getting used to the auto-dimming lightbox header. When it dims, it seems to draw more attention to it than if never dimmed in the first place and then I find myself wondering why it dimmed and if it's not broken. Maybe something you get used to, but it seems a bit disconcerting as a novice viewer. For the selling pro, I'm not sure they want the Buy button dimmed light that.
Share leaves Lightbox. If you're in Lightbox and you click Share/Get a Link, it takes you completely out of lightbox making Share not feel like it's actually a Lightbox function. Why can't you be in Lightbox, select a Share option, execute that option and stay where you were in Lightbox?
No gallery name. Lightbox shows no indication of what gallery you're in.
Generally, I like the new display. Unfortunately, it completely wipes out my drop down menu system once you select a specific gallery to view. Am I going to be able to put that back in place? Also, like many have already commented, I have HTML in gallery descriptions - most are to create small informational tables using HTML and corresponding CSS code in my customizer.
Am I "hearing" this correctly? With this re-design the ability to use html in a gallery description will disappear or be greatly compromised? If this is true then this will be one unhappy camper.
A few observations:
The buy button is too prominent and too colorful (but maybe this color will be controlled by themes?)
I noticed that in the old smugmug gallery style that when you go into the lightbox, there is a small, 2-4 px sized grey border that appears around the image. i don't see this in the new smugmug gallery. Please don't overlook this. This border can be very helpful in setting off an image that has a lot shadows or dark/near black color around the edge of the image from the background of the lightbox, especially if one's site is set to a black background.
Also, while I am on the subject, please consider the need for an option to create this small pixel border when re-designing the slideshow gallery. I have always found it frustrating that it is available as an option if you generate a slideshow through the share button, but there is no option to add one to a regular slideshow gallery or the fullscreen slideshow gallery.
Waiting with baited breath
9 days since this was first announced and the more time passes the more uneasy I'm becoming about uploading images and creating new galleries, adding descriptions etc.
Thank heavens for JFriend, I feel that we would be thrown to the lions without him fighting our corner at Smugmug.
Please can we have some positive feedback. Something to re-assure those of us with so called 'page destroying html in gallery descriptions' that our sites have a future here as they stand.
Come on guys, it's no good just letting the comments pile up in these threads without any meaningful answers.
9 days since this was first announced and the more time passes the more uneasy I'm becoming about uploading images and creating new galleries, adding descriptions etc.
Thank heavens for JFriend, I feel that we would be thrown to the lions without him fighting our corner at Smugmug.
Please can we have some positive feedback. Something to re-assure those of us with so called 'page destroying html in gallery descriptions' that our sites have a future here as they stand.
Come on guys, it's no good just letting the comments pile up in these threads without any meaningful answers.
Caroline
I am also surprised how little Smugmug feedback there has been here (I was hoping for some open discussion with designers) - though I do know from some back channel communications related to my visit that they are reading/discussing internally. I'm off to visit Smugmug this afternoon to discuss. Hopefully I'll have a better sense for which way things are going after that, but they have put me under an NDA for things discussed in my visit so they can tell me more than they intend to be public now so I don't know what I'll be able to say about the visit.
I am also surprised how little Smugmug feedback there has been here - though I do know from some back channel communications related to my visit that they are reading/discussing internally. I'm off to visit Smugmug this afternoon to discuss. Hopefully I'll have a better sense for which way things are going after that, but they have put me under and NDA for things discussed in my visit so they can tell me more than they intend to be public now so I don't know what I'll be able to say about the visit.
It seems they are failing to appreciate the seriousness of this from the clients point of view, and depending on the high levels of loyalty shown in the past. That will count for nothing if they don't address this properly and communicate - OneThumb opened this discussion by showing off the 'sneak peek', let's have some honest open feedback from him now. (For heavens sake when are they going to grow up and use real names)
This comment at the beginning of his post does nothing to reassure me, rather makes me wonder why there hasn't been a period of beta testing with live accounts before releasing any details at all.
First, the disclaimer: We're not done yet, by a long shot. Nothing is set in stone, and there will be bugs
I hope you can impress upon the Smugmug team how important it is that you come back to us with something John.
Let's not forget that these forums are public and this saga is there for anyone to see - it doesn't reflect well on Smugmug.
I think you (all) are too impatient... ;-) SmugMug needs to digest ALL (expected and unexpected) comments and feedback. After all, it's only a sneak preview of something they envision and that they already want to share with us (at large) to make sure they are on the right track.
That's why they ask us for comments. They need our comments and feedback. After all, this current version is not cut in stone or even a final version (on the contrary). You should keep this in your mind.
They need to analyze what is do-able short-term and long-term. With such a huge number of customers, each one has its own demands and expectations, often conflicting the expectations of other customers, they have to find some balance too.
The fact that they asked us for comments and feedback is their first step that you should be grateful for .
This is not an emergency situation, though it looks like for some ;-) Reading the messages/posts, the galleries will not change overnight yet ;-)
Though the preview may not be perfect (SmugMug did know this in advance and that's why they asked us for feedback), they are on the right track with the new cleaner design.
I think most comments have been made, so I will not make any further comments till another version is ready for PRE-view.
Thanks SmugMug for your time (and patience with all these customers who have so much conflicting desires and expectations) and for the updates and continuous improvements you make.
It seems they are failing to appreciate the seriousness of this from the clients point of view, and depending on the high levels of loyalty shown in the past. That will count for nothing if they don't address this properly and communicate - OneThumb opened this discussion by showing off the 'sneak peek', let's have some honest open feedback from him now. (For heavens sake when are they going to grow up and use real names)
This comment at the beginning of his post does nothing to reassure me, rather makes me wonder why there hasn't been a period of beta testing with live accounts before releasing any details at all.
I hope you can impress upon the Smugmug team how important it is that you come back to us with something John.
Let's not forget that these forums are public and this saga is there for anyone to see - it doesn't reflect well on Smugmug.
I would like to see better buttons. I think Andy said they're working on it. I'd like the ability to choose rounded/sharp corners, as well as color (custom gradients would be great). Or maybe the new desin won't need any buttons like the old design?
... they are on the right track with the new cleaner design....
I think you're missing the point, WE, those who customize, don't want a new
design, we want improved performance. WE get the design we want through
customization and don't want some cookie cutter site. It sounds like they
are sacrificing customizing for speed.
I'm not looking for more speed, for me the major holdup loading is the stuff in
the footer, statcounter, Google Analytics, flagcounter, including the huge
wait for FB junk to load. They need to find a way to load all that after the
photos are loaded.
I think you're missing the point, WE, those who customize, don't want a new
design, we want improved performance. WE get the design we want through
customization and don't want some cookie cutter site. It sounds like they
are sacrificing customizing for speed.
I'm not looking for more speed, for me the major holdup loading is the stuff in
the footer, statcounter, Google Analytics, flagcounter, including the huge
wait for FB junk to load. They need to find a way to load all that after the
photos are loaded.
I agree. I like Smugmug, but I also pride myself by trying to make my SM site NOT look like a SM site as much as possible. I hope this continues...
Hopefully I'll have a better sense for which way things are going after that, but they have put me under an NDA for things discussed in my visit so they can tell me more than they intend to be public now so I don't know what I'll be able to say about the visit.
I know that if you're not as worried after your visit, I won't be, even if you can't discuss the details.
Comments
tx
--- Denise
Musings & ramblings at https://denisegoldberg.blogspot.com
Ditto!!
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http://www.mikejulianaphotography.com/SkiRacing/2011-Season/May-Day-Races-Sat-and-Sun/16884898_XVdC3k#1275353339_h7ZdkPS
Note that this is done at both the gallery and sub-category using HTML and CSS. This feature differentiates me in the market and I've received lots of feedback on this ability. I spent a lot of time getting this working. Under the "new" feature set, how will I be able to do this?
How will we add Paypal functionality to our sites? I typically do this in the gallery description as well.
Again, the ability to do some of these "unique" things is a huge draw for some of us. Please make sure you really understand how these" features" really enable some of your pros and please reassure us that we can accomplisth these types of things in the future.
Comments and constructive criticism always welcome.
www.mikejulianaphotography.com
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Since SM seem to want the "customizing album description" comments to be in a different thread, please add your additional comments on that over here rather than in this thread. We need more examples to show SM. Please post your examples of useful HTML in gallery description or captions here.
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I'm not sure I understand... there will be no support for HTML-only pages? Can anyone confirm this?
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Rich
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Can we get a style worked on that is more centered around video files and the information related to them. Something that will allow my clients to find their content fast and know if they are on version 1, 2, 3 or 20
Thanks
Ray T
Videos have not played in the slideshow for years while flickr has had this feature for years, and videos still do not play in the gallery, just in the lightbox. These are some needed functions that would greatly outweight any 'prettiness' imo.
Want faster uploading? Vote for FTP!
Thanks John. That does make sense then. I was confused because I wanted to click on the play icon in the centre of the image but felt that I couldn't 'point' at that icon because my mouse had turned into the magnifier. Of course as soon as I click on the image it works but it felt a little unnatural. On a straight photo it would have felt correct of course.
DayBreak, my Folk Music Group (some free mp3s!) http://daybreakfolk.com
photos because clicking photo returns to gallery. But for videos it has to be
clicked and it's not obvious at all.
I would get rid of the X icon and add a text button "Back to gallery". Maybe
even making the text a bright color or red. Something we can customize to
our own taste. Another idea, instead of the icon use the letter X in a box,
then the text "X" can also be customized with js to say anything.
I find it very disturbing I can not choose the size for lightbox without first
going into lightbox. Then there is no obvious size picker. I don't think "auto" is
very smart, it should say "sizes", duh.
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A few additional comments:
Lightbox:
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A few observations:
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9 days since this was first announced and the more time passes the more uneasy I'm becoming about uploading images and creating new galleries, adding descriptions etc.
Thank heavens for JFriend, I feel that we would be thrown to the lions without him fighting our corner at Smugmug.
Please can we have some positive feedback. Something to re-assure those of us with so called 'page destroying html in gallery descriptions' that our sites have a future here as they stand.
Come on guys, it's no good just letting the comments pile up in these threads without any meaningful answers.
Caroline
www.carolineshipsey.co.uk - Follow me on G+
[/URL]
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It seems they are failing to appreciate the seriousness of this from the clients point of view, and depending on the high levels of loyalty shown in the past. That will count for nothing if they don't address this properly and communicate - OneThumb opened this discussion by showing off the 'sneak peek', let's have some honest open feedback from him now. (For heavens sake when are they going to grow up and use real names)
This comment at the beginning of his post does nothing to reassure me, rather makes me wonder why there hasn't been a period of beta testing with live accounts before releasing any details at all.
I hope you can impress upon the Smugmug team how important it is that you come back to us with something John.
Let's not forget that these forums are public and this saga is there for anyone to see - it doesn't reflect well on Smugmug.
Caroline
www.carolineshipsey.co.uk - Follow me on G+
[/URL]
That's why they ask us for comments. They need our comments and feedback. After all, this current version is not cut in stone or even a final version (on the contrary). You should keep this in your mind.
They need to analyze what is do-able short-term and long-term. With such a huge number of customers, each one has its own demands and expectations, often conflicting the expectations of other customers, they have to find some balance too.
The fact that they asked us for comments and feedback is their first step that you should be grateful for
This is not an emergency situation, though it looks like for some ;-) Reading the messages/posts, the galleries will not change overnight yet ;-)
Though the preview may not be perfect (SmugMug did know this in advance and that's why they asked us for feedback), they are on the right track with the new cleaner design.
I think most comments have been made, so I will not make any further comments till another version is ready for PRE-view.
Thanks SmugMug for your time (and patience with all these customers who have so much conflicting desires and expectations) and for the updates and continuous improvements you make.
Luc
design, we want improved performance. WE get the design we want through
customization and don't want some cookie cutter site. It sounds like they
are sacrificing customizing for speed.
I'm not looking for more speed, for me the major holdup loading is the stuff in
the footer, statcounter, Google Analytics, flagcounter, including the huge
wait for FB junk to load. They need to find a way to load all that after the
photos are loaded.
My Website index | My Blog
I agree. I like Smugmug, but I also pride myself by trying to make my SM site NOT look like a SM site as much as possible. I hope this continues...
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That's what I meant by "conflicting expectations": we customers all want different things.. Some want speed, others want customization etc. etc.
I think (I'm actually sure) SmugMug got it and will not let you down and find balance in the desires and expectations of their customers!
Luc
I'm just waiting until the dust settles and pick up the pieces and hopefully I won't have to use too much glue...
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