Who's problems did you fix and how did you fix them?
Again, without any actual info it sounds like this is just another pile of BS that your'e shoveling to try and keep us at bay.
Ben,
I don't think it is beneficial for me to come on here and lie to our customers just to "keep you at bay". What would I say when, 3 days from now, you and 10 others on this thread tell me that it is still happening to them? Then, not only would I have very upset customers, but I would add very upset bosses to the equation.
I am sorry you do not believe me. Besides giving you access to our code and back end systems, I don't see any way to prove it to you other than my word. We were able to reproduce it, and implemented a fixed that was causing the issue we found. We think this will help in other use cases, but as I said, this may not apply to every single use case out there. But I think giving us the benefit of the doubt and trying it for a couple of days before you claim we are lying about a fix would not be asking too much.
Please let me know if it continues to happen to you, and provide as much information about the workflow before the log out happened.
If you step back and look at this from the consumer (ie. me) point of view, it certainly appears that this is what is happening. This thread is 6 months old. SmugMug reps have posted many times, but not given any specific details on improvements or fixes. The issue is still affecting users, although SmugMug says it's a very low percentage (but has not provided any factual info to back this up). As of yesterday I was still getting logged out (even after your post). So from my point of view it just seems like another time where SmugMug is claiming to have done something, but I see no change on my end.
I do not need to see your code. If you could simply explain what root cause you have found and corrected that would certainly help. From what I can tell, you either don't know what the fix was, or the details behind it, or there was no fix at all. Otherwise I see absolutely no reason you would not post the details as this would only help to improve the customer satisfaction (ie. show that you've actually done anything at all). To me it is obvious that something changed within the SmugMug system. This issue was not present at all until about 6 months ago and then it started happening to many users at once. SmugMug needs to fix it, or at least tell the users what has changed.
I just was logged out on my home pc (windows 7) today. I had gotten two orders last night and checked the site before I went to bed. When I went to proof the crops just now, had to log in again.
But thank you for your efforts. No difference yet though.
I just was logged out on my home pc (windows 7) today. I had gotten two orders last night and checked the site before I went to bed. When I went to proof the crops just now, had to log in again.
But thank you for your efforts. No difference yet though.
It is possible your session from before the changes were implemented was still active. Please keep a vigilant eye on it, and just like you did, make sure to provide me with as much information about your workflow prior to the session expiration.
If you step back and look at this from the consumer (ie. me) point of view, it certainly appears that this is what is happening. This thread is 6 months old. SmugMug reps have posted many times, but not given any specific details on improvements or fixes. The issue is still affecting users, although SmugMug says it's a very low percentage (but has not provided any factual info to back this up). As of yesterday I was still getting logged out (even after your post). So from my point of view it just seems like another time where SmugMug is claiming to have done something, but I see no change on my end.
I do not need to see your code. If you could simply explain what root cause you have found and corrected that would certainly help. From what I can tell, you either don't know what the fix was, or the details behind it, or there was no fix at all. Otherwise I see absolutely no reason you would not post the details as this would only help to improve the customer satisfaction (ie. show that you've actually done anything at all). To me it is obvious that something changed within the SmugMug system. This issue was not present at all until about 6 months ago and then it started happening to many users at once. SmugMug needs to fix it, or at least tell the users what has changed.
Ben,
While it is true we don't feel it is necessary to divulge information about our behind the scenes actions, I think you would be hard pressed to find a case where we blatantly lie to our customers. As I have stated, we implemented a change that we know has fixed this issue in certain use cases. Does this cover EVERY single use case? We are not sure. That's why we are asking you to be vigilant and report your workflow before the premature log out.
Please make sure you log out, close your browser, and even restart your computer before starting a new session to make sure all changes are in effect.
As I stated, we will not go into details of our back end work or systems.
Michael
I have never received such blatantly unhelpful customer service from any company in the past. I will to continue to hold the opinion that you are doing nothing but posting untrue information online in hopes of pushing this off long enough that users will accept it as the new normal.
I have never received such blatantly unhelpful customer service from any company in the past. I will to continue to hold the opinion that you are doing nothing but posting untrue information online in hopes of pushing this off long enough that users will accept it as the new normal.
Ben,
I truly apologize this is not good enough for you. We have never, and will never talk about technical details of our back end. I am not suddenly making this determination out of nowhere. As I said before, We applied a change that we are sure fixed this issue in certain cases. I have stated time and time again and have asked you and the others to be even more vigilant and to try to give me a breakdown of your SmugMug workflow prior to the log out. I have emailed our support heros asking them to get the same workflow information and to notify me immediately if they hear any new cases of this occurring. Myself and the rest of the QA team put a great amount of hours into this after we were able to find a reproducible case, so I do think your accusation of "SmugMug is lying" is a little unfair.
I tried to give you the benefit of the doubt, but months later I personally have yet to see anything to sway me otherwise. Just claims of "fixes" and nothing being fixed.
I'm sorry, but from a consumer standpoint it appears as if you have done nothing and the "can't say anything" stance makes it appear as if you are trying to hide this fact.
I'll change my opinion when I receive any shred of evidence that you have actually fixed or changed anything at all. I don't think that's too much to ask.
I tried to give you the benefit of the doubt, but months later I personally have yet to see anything to sway me otherwise. Just claims of "fixes" and nothing being fixed.
I'm sorry, but from a consumer standpoint it appears as if you have done nothing and the "can't say anything" stance makes it appear as if you are trying to hide this fact.
I'll change my opinion when I receive any shred of evidence that you have actually fixed or changed anything at all. I don't think that's too much to ask.
I don't think asking you to simply use SmugMug as you normally would and give me detailed workflows if it happens again is too much to ask either. We want to eliminate all occurrences of this, but if you won't help us, then it is harder to track down, therefore upsetting you more. Please provide me with your workflow if this happens again.
I never had this issue once until the Fall 2012 update when it started for everyone else (ie. it was something SmugMug did to cause it).
I have not changed anything in my workflow before or since then. It still occurs.
I have posted my workflow and other info at least once, please look for it unless it was deleted when some of the threads were killed.
None of you're "fixes" have resolved the issue for me, and you have not provided any info as to what has been "fixed".
I do not believe any of the burden of fixing this lies on the consumer. In my opinion I should just tell you there is a problem, and you fix it. If it was an issue I had caused, then I would be happy to help. Since it was caused by a SmugMug update, it should be SmugMug's responsibility to fix. I have gone out of my way to post info and it apparently has not helped.
Since this SmugMug caused issue started I have undoubtedly lost dozen of hours simply logging in over and over when I should not have to. The monetary compensation for this lost time will obviously never be resolved. I continue to waste more and more time on this (including hearing you claim to have implemented mystery "fixes" that do nothing).
I am not asking you to help "fix" this. Like most bugs in all major software companies, it helps QA and Engineering teams trouble shoot an issue if they know how a customer stumbled upon it.
You do not need to provide us with a workflow. It can help, but was just a suggestion. But it is entirely up to you if you wish to provide your workflow from now on.
For what it's worth, and to inject one positive note in here, I have not had any of the formerly recurring log-in issues since the recent fix that Michael reported on February 28 !! I've used my site quite a bit since then and have done color fixes, cropping, shut down browsers and the computer itself, etc. I've been consistently staying logged in (yippeee) throughout everything I've done. I think I even logged out purposely once & logged back in, and no problems. So from my corner, thank you for this fix that has at least helped me out!! I haven't tried any other browsers besides FF yet, but I'll let you know if anything else seems amiss.
For what it's worth, and to inject one positive note in here, I have not had any of the formerly recurring log-in issues since the recent fix that Michael reported on February 28 !! I've used my site quite a bit since then and have done color fixes, cropping, shut down browsers and the computer itself, etc. I've been consistently staying logged in (yippeee) throughout everything I've done. I think I even logged out purposely once & logged back in, and no problems. So from my corner, thank you for this fix that has at least helped me out!! I haven't tried any other browsers besides FF yet, but I'll let you know if anything else seems amiss.
Thanks Anna Lisa!!! I am glad to hear it seems to be working better for you. Maybe we did apply a change after all. :
Please let me know if you run into this again, and as I stated, any information about your most recent workflow before the log out would be greatly appreciated.
Heya David,
Can you let me know what you were doing before you were logged out? have you restarted your browser/computer in the last day?
Thanks!
Michael
I was doing nothing unusual. I turn the Mac off and on a couple times per day when not in use (not hibernate mode - a hard shut down).
What would now be four or five days ago, I logged in to my SM (had to) and again checked the "leave me logged in" box, which I always do when prompted. What struck me odd was when accessing my account settings, it forced me to enter my email and SM password, which it hadn't asked me to do in a while (the normal from about a year ago for security). This is when I read about the sorcerer's supposed fix. I had thought, hooray, fixed! But that would be short lived.
So then a day back or so, I have had to again log in every single session (after a hard shut down). But within each session, I do remain logged in, even though I might close out my SM browser tab and re-load a new tab hours later. Even the account settings area is clear to go right in without the email song and dance. That is normal behavior whether the login issue has been broken or not, within a session, which I define as having the computer on constantly.
Since it is probable that one might need to log in to both their SM, and then also "log in" to access their account settings, could there be a cookie conflict? Are there two or more cookies for these logging-in activities on one's local machine, or is the account settings access a cookie-less process?
Mac OS & Safari.
My Smugmug
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take" - Wayne Gretzky
I was doing nothing unusual. I turn the Mac off and on a couple times per day when not in use (not hibernate mode - a hard shut down).
What would now be four or five days ago, I logged in to my SM (had to) and again checked the "leave me logged in" box, which I always do when prompted. What struck me odd was when accessing my account settings, it forced me to enter my email and SM password, which it hadn't asked me to do in a while (the normal from about a year ago for security). This is when I read about the sorcerer's supposed fix. I had thought, hooray, fixed! But that would be short lived.
So then a day back or so, I have had to again log in every single session (after a hard shut down). But within each session, I do remain logged in, even though I might close out my SM browser tab and re-load a new tab hours later. Even the account settings area is clear to go right in without the email song and dance. That is normal behavior whether the login issue has been broken or not, within a session, which I define as having the computer on constantly.
Since it is probable that one might need to log in to both their SM, and then also "log in" to access their account settings, could there be a cookie conflict? Are there two or more cookies for these logging-in activities on one's local machine, or is the account settings access a cookie-less process?
Mac OS & Safari.
Heya David,
Has it happened to you today? And what actions are you performing in your SmugMug on a daily basis. Simple uploading, or are you watermarking, cropping, etc?
I was logged out again yesterday or today on three devices: home pc, ipad mini, and android phone. I checked stats; that was about all. I always close firefox even if just hibernating the computer, so the session must be new on the pc. Not sure how the phone and ipad work with sessions, since they always seem to be 'on'. But regardless, I'm being logged out more this week than in the recent past, not less.
1) turned on computer this morning
2) Was still logged in from last night
3) Closed Safari
4) Shutdown computer
5) 1.5 hours laters turned on computer and opened Sarfari
6) Went to Smugmug and was logged out
7) User name and password was there
8) "Keep me logged in" was NOT checked. (Obviously I keep it checked all the time.)
Cant log in on my iSmug app on my iPhone
I keep getting logged out of iSmug app on my iPhone and to login again and again. What's going on???
I reloaded the app twice with no avail. Please let me know how to fix this problem.
I keep getting logged out of iSmug app on my iPhone and to login again and again. What's going on???
I reloaded the app twice with no avail. Please let me know how to fix this problem.
Unfortunately, iSmug is not a app developed by SmugMug, so aside from implementing the changes on our end for the SmugMug UI, you would have to contact the App developer.
1) turned on computer this morning
2) Was still logged in from last night
3) Closed Safari
4) Shutdown computer
5) 1.5 hours laters turned on computer and opened Sarfari
6) Went to Smugmug and was logged out
7) User name and password was there
8) "Keep me logged in" was NOT checked. (Obviously I keep it checked all the time.)
Has it happened to you today? And what actions are you performing in your SmugMug on a daily basis. Simple uploading, or are you watermarking, cropping, etc?
Thanks!
Michael
I've changed nothing, but I've had to log in every single time for the past 5 days after shutting down.
My Smugmug
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take" - Wayne Gretzky
Comments
Who's problems did you fix and how did you fix them?
Again, without any actual info it sounds like this is just another pile of BS that your'e shoveling to try and keep us at bay.
Ben,
I don't think it is beneficial for me to come on here and lie to our customers just to "keep you at bay". What would I say when, 3 days from now, you and 10 others on this thread tell me that it is still happening to them? Then, not only would I have very upset customers, but I would add very upset bosses to the equation.
I am sorry you do not believe me. Besides giving you access to our code and back end systems, I don't see any way to prove it to you other than my word. We were able to reproduce it, and implemented a fixed that was causing the issue we found. We think this will help in other use cases, but as I said, this may not apply to every single use case out there. But I think giving us the benefit of the doubt and trying it for a couple of days before you claim we are lying about a fix would not be asking too much.
Please let me know if it continues to happen to you, and provide as much information about the workflow before the log out happened.
Thanks!
Michael
Facebook
Google+
Twitter
Photo Blog
If you step back and look at this from the consumer (ie. me) point of view, it certainly appears that this is what is happening. This thread is 6 months old. SmugMug reps have posted many times, but not given any specific details on improvements or fixes. The issue is still affecting users, although SmugMug says it's a very low percentage (but has not provided any factual info to back this up). As of yesterday I was still getting logged out (even after your post). So from my point of view it just seems like another time where SmugMug is claiming to have done something, but I see no change on my end.
I do not need to see your code. If you could simply explain what root cause you have found and corrected that would certainly help. From what I can tell, you either don't know what the fix was, or the details behind it, or there was no fix at all. Otherwise I see absolutely no reason you would not post the details as this would only help to improve the customer satisfaction (ie. show that you've actually done anything at all). To me it is obvious that something changed within the SmugMug system. This issue was not present at all until about 6 months ago and then it started happening to many users at once. SmugMug needs to fix it, or at least tell the users what has changed.
But thank you for your efforts. No difference yet though.
It is possible your session from before the changes were implemented was still active. Please keep a vigilant eye on it, and just like you did, make sure to provide me with as much information about your workflow prior to the session expiration.
Thanks!
Michael
Facebook
Google+
Twitter
Photo Blog
Ben,
While it is true we don't feel it is necessary to divulge information about our behind the scenes actions, I think you would be hard pressed to find a case where we blatantly lie to our customers. As I have stated, we implemented a change that we know has fixed this issue in certain use cases. Does this cover EVERY single use case? We are not sure. That's why we are asking you to be vigilant and report your workflow before the premature log out.
Please make sure you log out, close your browser, and even restart your computer before starting a new session to make sure all changes are in effect.
Thanks.
Michael
Facebook
Google+
Twitter
Photo Blog
Ben,
As I stated, we will not go into details of our back end work or systems.
Michael
Facebook
Google+
Twitter
Photo Blog
Ben,
I truly apologize this is not good enough for you. We have never, and will never talk about technical details of our back end. I am not suddenly making this determination out of nowhere. As I said before, We applied a change that we are sure fixed this issue in certain cases. I have stated time and time again and have asked you and the others to be even more vigilant and to try to give me a breakdown of your SmugMug workflow prior to the log out. I have emailed our support heros asking them to get the same workflow information and to notify me immediately if they hear any new cases of this occurring. Myself and the rest of the QA team put a great amount of hours into this after we were able to find a reproducible case, so I do think your accusation of "SmugMug is lying" is a little unfair.
Michael
Facebook
Google+
Twitter
Photo Blog
I'm sorry, but from a consumer standpoint it appears as if you have done nothing and the "can't say anything" stance makes it appear as if you are trying to hide this fact.
I'll change my opinion when I receive any shred of evidence that you have actually fixed or changed anything at all. I don't think that's too much to ask.
I don't think asking you to simply use SmugMug as you normally would and give me detailed workflows if it happens again is too much to ask either. We want to eliminate all occurrences of this, but if you won't help us, then it is harder to track down, therefore upsetting you more. Please provide me with your workflow if this happens again.
Thank you.
Michael
Facebook
Google+
Twitter
Photo Blog
I do not believe any of the burden of fixing this lies on the consumer. In my opinion I should just tell you there is a problem, and you fix it. If it was an issue I had caused, then I would be happy to help. Since it was caused by a SmugMug update, it should be SmugMug's responsibility to fix. I have gone out of my way to post info and it apparently has not helped.
Since this SmugMug caused issue started I have undoubtedly lost dozen of hours simply logging in over and over when I should not have to. The monetary compensation for this lost time will obviously never be resolved. I continue to waste more and more time on this (including hearing you claim to have implemented mystery "fixes" that do nothing).
I am not asking you to help "fix" this. Like most bugs in all major software companies, it helps QA and Engineering teams trouble shoot an issue if they know how a customer stumbled upon it.
You do not need to provide us with a workflow. It can help, but was just a suggestion. But it is entirely up to you if you wish to provide your workflow from now on.
Michael
Michael Bonocore
www.mb-photography-sf.com
www.facebook.com/mbonocore
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Thanks Anna Lisa!!! I am glad to hear it seems to be working better for you. Maybe we did apply a change after all.
Please let me know if you run into this again, and as I stated, any information about your most recent workflow before the log out would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks!
Michael
Facebook
Google+
Twitter
Photo Blog
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take" - Wayne Gretzky
Heya David,
Can you let me know what you were doing before you were logged out? have you restarted your browser/computer in the last day?
Thanks!
Michael
Facebook
Google+
Twitter
Photo Blog
I was doing nothing unusual. I turn the Mac off and on a couple times per day when not in use (not hibernate mode - a hard shut down).
What would now be four or five days ago, I logged in to my SM (had to) and again checked the "leave me logged in" box, which I always do when prompted. What struck me odd was when accessing my account settings, it forced me to enter my email and SM password, which it hadn't asked me to do in a while (the normal from about a year ago for security). This is when I read about the sorcerer's supposed fix. I had thought, hooray, fixed! But that would be short lived.
So then a day back or so, I have had to again log in every single session (after a hard shut down). But within each session, I do remain logged in, even though I might close out my SM browser tab and re-load a new tab hours later. Even the account settings area is clear to go right in without the email song and dance. That is normal behavior whether the login issue has been broken or not, within a session, which I define as having the computer on constantly.
Since it is probable that one might need to log in to both their SM, and then also "log in" to access their account settings, could there be a cookie conflict? Are there two or more cookies for these logging-in activities on one's local machine, or is the account settings access a cookie-less process?
Mac OS & Safari.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take" - Wayne Gretzky
Heya David,
Has it happened to you today? And what actions are you performing in your SmugMug on a daily basis. Simple uploading, or are you watermarking, cropping, etc?
Thanks!
Michael
Facebook
Google+
Twitter
Photo Blog
Keep you posted
Michael
Michael Bonocore
www.mb-photography-sf.com
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plus.mb-photography-sf.com
Facebook
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Logged out again today.
1) turned on computer this morning
2) Was still logged in from last night
3) Closed Safari
4) Shutdown computer
5) 1.5 hours laters turned on computer and opened Sarfari
6) Went to Smugmug and was logged out
7) User name and password was there
8) "Keep me logged in" was NOT checked. (Obviously I keep it checked all the time.)
--Dave
I keep getting logged out of iSmug app on my iPhone and to login again and again. What's going on???
I reloaded the app twice with no avail. Please let me know how to fix this problem.
Unfortunately, iSmug is not a app developed by SmugMug, so aside from implementing the changes on our end for the SmugMug UI, you would have to contact the App developer.
Michael Bonocore
www.mb-photography-sf.com
www.facebook.com/mbonocore
plus.mb-photography-sf.com
Facebook
Google+
Twitter
Photo Blog
Dave,
Did you do anything on Smugmug between steps 2&3?
Michael Bonocore
www.mb-photography-sf.com
www.facebook.com/mbonocore
plus.mb-photography-sf.com
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I've changed nothing, but I've had to log in every single time for the past 5 days after shutting down.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take" - Wayne Gretzky