We're definitely still open to the idea, but this is a first release and it complicates the UI considerably both for the Pro and the customer. EZ Prints does professional-quality printing that we are quite happy with. Bay Photo adds hand color correction, higher quality packaging, shipping from a different location, and different products.
We don't want to distinguish between them by calling one "Pro" and one not, especially because many of your customers probably wouldn't understand the difference. So if we are able to figure out a solution, we want the control to be in your hands rather than theirs.
Just got in and was able to check out the new Buy Button.
Great addition to the already fabulous service we get with SM. I'm off to order some prints so I can compare the labs side by side... though I'm sure I'll be using Bay exclusively from here out.
Thanks for rolling out the new printing options!! Bay does fantastic work and having it integrated as part of the standard workflow will really make things nice. I am looking forward to trying out more of the new services.
Thanks again for rolling it out!
Keep Shooting!
John
I'm a power user but like the prospect of using the pro lab and may upgrade. Does Smug have an example UI that I can view to see how it is constructed?
I'm a power user but like the prospect of using the pro lab and may upgrade. Does Smug have an example UI that I can view to see how it is constructed?
Hi Chris, example UI of which stuff? The main difference is in the pro pricing page, where you set prices for prints... and then the reporting page, where you see orders from customers. You can see it if you have 2nd email address, you can just set up a free trial... I'm so sorry there's no way to experiment with the pro version on your existing account without upgrading.
Hi Chris, example UI of which stuff? The main difference is in the pro pricing page, where you set prices for prints... and then the reporting page, where you see orders from customers. You can see it if you have 2nd email address, you can just set up a free trial... I'm so sorry there's no way to experiment with the pro version on your existing account without upgrading.
Thanks, I thought about setting up a trial account to play around with it. I thought maybe there was an image of what the bayphoto interface looks like (maybe you could send me a screenshot?)... really I just wanted to see the interface and print options how they would look for a pro-- size, paper type, etc.
Chris
Thanks, I thought about setting up a trial account to play around with it. I thought maybe there was an image of what the bayphoto interface looks like (maybe you could send me a screenshot?)... really I just wanted to see the interface and print options how they would look for a pro-- size, paper type, etc.
Chris
Thanks for your response. My primary concern today is fine art prints, including, abstracts, landscapes, and B&W. That said, (I'm not holding you to it) which if any of the three options would recommend, at least to start with?
Hey Sam,
I was surprised to hear that when we were doing our tests and I was watching the color specialists at Bay work, they didn't like adjusting landscape/fine art prints. They talked about blacks, shadow detail, saturation, highlights, etc., like the masters that they are, but the issue is there's a lot of artistic interpretation and personal taste that goes behind landscapes.
By contrast, they know exactly what to do with shots that have people in them. That's one reason whcc makes it clear that they serve just the wedding market.
So my recommendation is to adjust your fine art photos yourself. I do that too with my shots, which I find enjoyable because there are just a few shots and you get to spend a fair amount of time per shot.
But when I shoot an event with people? Thank goodness for their color correction services.
I've not much experience with printing, but have been following this thread and researching the various companies mentioned. Miller's, for example, provides calibration software that enables you to calibrate your monitor so you view the image as it will look after printed by them. Is there any similar option (or workaround) for Bayphoto, especially if they mainly rely on us to do corrections for landscape and abstracts? Its one thing if you print your own images, but to make corrections back and forth by mail can be time consuming if a customer is waiting for his/her print.
Thanks
Baldy, Andy, everyone at SmugMug... a huge THANK YOU to all of you! This is fantastic!
I've long used Bay Photo as a backup to my SmugMug account not only for their quality but because I can usually count on 1-day shipping to the S.F. Bay Area--which is where most of my clients are. From EZPrints in Georgia, shipping times have been more variable, and of course, longer.
I've just updated my portfolio pricing for printing at Bay.
This is a great added service, and I really appreciate all the time and effort that went into it!
I've not much experience with printing, but have been following this thread and researching the various companies mentioned. Miller's, for example, provides calibration software that enables you to calibrate your monitor so you view the image as it will look after printed by them. Is there any similar option (or workaround) for Bayphoto, especially if they mainly rely on us to do corrections for landscape and abstracts? Its one thing if you print your own images, but to make corrections back and forth by mail can be time consuming if a customer is waiting for his/her print.
Thanks
Get their icc profile, soft proof against it. http://www.smugmug.com/help/display-color holler in our finishing school forum here on Dgrin if you'd like some help with it. Of course, we'll happily do some test prints for you.
One is you now set your preference for color adjustment, which removes the choice from the customer's hands in the shopping cart. They no longer have to scratch their heads over what auto or true color means.
This also seems to have removed it from the power users?
I'm not a pro, I don't sell photos, and I don't buy a lot, but I like Smugmug, I use it, I say nice things about you...
And I tell you I feel betrayed by this.
I've been annoyed since inception I couldn't set true color as the default, now it appears I can't use it at all.
So basically you just doubled (more) my cost to give me the same services I have now?
Please say it ain't so?
I wouldn't be happy to see you have a nice new pro lab and I can't even pay a la carte for it, but if you just took away one of the key features I like about Smugmug....
I wouldn't be happy to see you have a nice new pro lab and I can't even pay a la carte for it, but if you just took away one of the key features I like about Smugmug....
Say it ain't so?!
Wow. I didn't notice that until now. Totally unacceptable.
I agree with you that it's disappointing, as a power user, not to have access to Bay Photo, but on that matter I think Andy's point (pro lab for pro customers) is reasonable.
But to take away an ability we already had - choosing auto or true color - what the heck? You don't have to be a pro to color correct your own photos. But now if you color correct them EZP is still going to run them through auto? (I assume that's the default now rather than true?) This is terrible, terrible decision making.
Wow. I didn't notice that until now. Totally unacceptable.
I agree with you that it's disappointing, as a power user, not to have access to Bay Photo, but on that matter I think Andy's point (pro lab for pro customers) is reasonable.
But to take away an ability we already had - choosing auto or true color - what the heck? You don't have to be a pro to color correct your own photos. But now if you color correct them EZP is still going to run them through auto? (I assume that's the default now rather than true?) This is terrible, terrible decision making.
I really hope we're wrong about this.
I don't have a std or power account to check, but I thought I read that the ability to pick true or auto color is still there, but it is now up to the site owner, not the person ordering the images.
Have you looked in gallery customization and in the control panel?
For pros, it's part of the set pricing interface (since it affects prices on the pro lab) so it's different for pros.
I agree with you that it's disappointing, as a power user, not to have access to Bay Photo, but on that matter I think Andy's point (pro lab for pro customers) is reasonable.
I vehemently disagree. Power users are the ones who would like to be able to do some advanced things (like perhaps adjust the backprinting, or print panoramics), but don't need pro features. Pro features are features like setting prices, doing packages, coupons, you know, things that people who make money being photographers do.
Printing is not a pro feature. Looks like more money is just going to go straight to the printer instead. I'm used to not getting new features at this point though. It seems that any new feature is either pro only, or available to everyone.
I don't have a std or power account to check, but I thought I read that the ability to pick true or auto color is still there, but it is now up to the site owner, not the person ordering the images.
Have you looked in gallery customization and in the control panel?
For pros, it's part of the set pricing interface (since it affects prices on the pro lab) so it's different for pros.
Update, Smugmug's help pages contain this screen shot for std and power users:
Which shows a color correction for std and power users. Nothing lost, it's just in a different place with added control for the site owner.
LIkewise, there's now global control of color correction in the Settings tag of the control panel:
Update, Smugmug's help pages contain this screen shot for std and power users:
Which shows a color correction for std and power users. Nothing lost, it's just in a different place with added control for the site owner.
Excellent news! I never would have looked for it there but glad you found it for us. (And, I'd point out, that option doesn't actually appear in my control panel yet. I can make gallery level changes but can't find the site-wide setting.)
renstar, we'll just have to disagree about the printing - and don't get me wrong, I'd love to use Bay Photo too. But it's not as if we're being prohibited from printing, we still have EZPrints. They added a pro printer with pro level pricing (higher) and pro level features (individual photo color correction). Again, I'm bummed about it but I think there's a reasonable case to be made for making this a Pro level offering.
Of course, we'll happily do some test prints for you.
I got so excited about the integration with Bay photo that I completely forgot about the fact that SmugMug would hook us up with some test prints. In all my excitement I ended up ordering 23-24 4x6's and an 8x10 giclee canvas board and an 8x10 giclee watercolour. All in all with shipping it was something like $115 USD. Wowsers, that's quite the thorough set of test prints.
So, in hindsight I wish I would have remembered the test print thing. Then again I did go a little overboard.
Standards and power customers can set the auto/true settings in their control panel. Look in your settings tab. More, here: http://www.smugmug.com/help/control-panel
Sorry for the delay in responding! I just flew back from California and this minute landed in NY. Hope this helps!
I'm used to not getting new features at this point though. It seems that any new feature is either pro only, or available to everyone.
Not really true In fact, just some months ago, we added custom host name (www.yourdomain.com) for power users and we added right-click protect for power users, too.
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Where DOES the "merchandise" come from? EZPrints?
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Great addition to the already fabulous service we get with SM. I'm off to order some prints so I can compare the labs side by side... though I'm sure I'll be using Bay exclusively from here out.
Thanks!
Thanks for rolling out the new printing options!! Bay does fantastic work and having it integrated as part of the standard workflow will really make things nice. I am looking forward to trying out more of the new services.
Thanks again for rolling it out!
Keep Shooting!
John
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Happiness is shooting a Nikon outside and posting on SmugMug!
Well done smugmug.. So now which one is better? EZPrints or BayPhoto?
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Thanks, I thought about setting up a trial account to play around with it. I thought maybe there was an image of what the bayphoto interface looks like (maybe you could send me a screenshot?)... really I just wanted to see the interface and print options how they would look for a pro-- size, paper type, etc.
Chris
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Alright, now that I verified that I'm a pro-user. How do I chose which Lab I want? I'm lost <img src="https://us.v-cdn.net/6029383/emoji/headscratch.gif" border="0" alt="" > - which is nothing new for me. <img src="https://us.v-cdn.net/6029383/emoji/rolleyes1.gif" border="0" alt="" >
thanks!
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I'd probably would have figured it out after I get off from work... maybe....
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Looking forward to seeing all the other 'teases' come to fruition in time.....
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I was surprised to hear that when we were doing our tests and I was watching the color specialists at Bay work, they didn't like adjusting landscape/fine art prints. They talked about blacks, shadow detail, saturation, highlights, etc., like the masters that they are, but the issue is there's a lot of artistic interpretation and personal taste that goes behind landscapes.
By contrast, they know exactly what to do with shots that have people in them. That's one reason whcc makes it clear that they serve just the wedding market.
So my recommendation is to adjust your fine art photos yourself. I do that too with my shots, which I find enjoyable because there are just a few shots and you get to spend a fair amount of time per shot.
But when I shoot an event with people? Thank goodness for their color correction services.
Will there be more panoramic sizes on offer, focusing on the 1:3 ratio (currently only one exists in this ratio)?
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I've long used Bay Photo as a backup to my SmugMug account not only for their quality but because I can usually count on 1-day shipping to the S.F. Bay Area--which is where most of my clients are. From EZPrints in Georgia, shipping times have been more variable, and of course, longer.
I've just updated my portfolio pricing for printing at Bay.
This is a great added service, and I really appreciate all the time and effort that went into it!
http://www.smugmug.com/help/display-color holler in our finishing school forum here on Dgrin if you'd like some help with it. Of course, we'll happily do some test prints for you.
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This also seems to have removed it from the power users?
I'm not a pro, I don't sell photos, and I don't buy a lot, but I like Smugmug, I use it, I say nice things about you...
And I tell you I feel betrayed by this.
I've been annoyed since inception I couldn't set true color as the default, now it appears I can't use it at all.
So basically you just doubled (more) my cost to give me the same services I have now?
Please say it ain't so?
I wouldn't be happy to see you have a nice new pro lab and I can't even pay a la carte for it, but if you just took away one of the key features I like about Smugmug....
Say it ain't so?!
Wow. I didn't notice that until now. Totally unacceptable.
I agree with you that it's disappointing, as a power user, not to have access to Bay Photo, but on that matter I think Andy's point (pro lab for pro customers) is reasonable.
But to take away an ability we already had - choosing auto or true color - what the heck? You don't have to be a pro to color correct your own photos. But now if you color correct them EZP is still going to run them through auto? (I assume that's the default now rather than true?) This is terrible, terrible decision making.
I really hope we're wrong about this.
I don't have a std or power account to check, but I thought I read that the ability to pick true or auto color is still there, but it is now up to the site owner, not the person ordering the images.
Have you looked in gallery customization and in the control panel?
For pros, it's part of the set pricing interface (since it affects prices on the pro lab) so it's different for pros.
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Printing is not a pro feature. Looks like more money is just going to go straight to the printer instead. I'm used to not getting new features at this point though. It seems that any new feature is either pro only, or available to everyone.
Update, Smugmug's help pages contain this screen shot for std and power users:
Which shows a color correction for std and power users. Nothing lost, it's just in a different place with added control for the site owner.
LIkewise, there's now global control of color correction in the Settings tag of the control panel:
Help pages with these images are:
http://www.smugmug.com/help/picture-storage and
http://www.smugmug.com/help/control-panel
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Excellent news!
renstar, we'll just have to disagree about the printing - and don't get me wrong, I'd love to use Bay Photo too. But it's not as if we're being prohibited from printing, we still have EZPrints. They added a pro printer with pro level pricing (higher) and pro level features (individual photo color correction). Again, I'm bummed about it but I think there's a reasonable case to be made for making this a Pro level offering.
I got so excited about the integration with Bay photo that I completely forgot about the fact that SmugMug would hook us up with some test prints. In all my excitement I ended up ordering 23-24 4x6's and an 8x10 giclee canvas board and an 8x10 giclee watercolour. All in all with shipping it was something like $115 USD. Wowsers, that's quite the thorough set of test prints.
So, in hindsight I wish I would have remembered the test print thing. Then again I did go a little overboard.
Not allowed to enter Henry's alone anymore...
Kyle Derkachenko Photography
http://www.smugmug.com/help/too-red
Standards and power customers can set the auto/true settings in their control panel. Look in your settings tab. More, here: http://www.smugmug.com/help/control-panel
Sorry for the delay in responding! I just flew back from California and this minute landed in NY. Hope this helps!
EDIT: Thanks to jfriend for explaining, too!
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