Before people get too carried away with forming an angry lynch mob,
The first time I got an image to the judging round, I (naturally) bragged about it to all my non-dgrin friends-- who immediately wanted to sign up so they could vote. I discouraged that behavior quite successfully (only one vote!) but I understand the natural inclination to want to help out a friend by voting. I doubt that whoever cast the votes even knew they were doing wrong.
The solution, in my mind, is either to explicitly spell out who is allowed to vote, or find entrants who don't have any friends. (UNpopular Photography?)
Sorry for the lack of smileys, I'm just not in the mood today.
Just checking in and learning of the controversy. Proud to have been chosen as one of the finalists, though the rest of the entries looked too good for me to hope to have placed. Sad to see the outcome ruined, however, by someone who cannot see these contests for what they are, a learning experience.
Had to pop in and say this, had to say something, in fact, because I was getting nervous about being one of the finalists, and being relatively new around here, and thinking you guys must all be wondering who did it. I got no candlesticks here!
Before people get too carried away with forming an angry lynch mob,
The first time I got an image to the judging round, I (naturally) bragged about it to all my non-dgrin friends-- who immediately wanted to sign up so they could vote. I discouraged that behavior quite successfully (only one vote!) but I understand the natural inclination to want to help out a friend by voting. I doubt that whoever cast the votes even knew they were doing wrong.
I hope the mods at least have private pm'ed this person to let them know they have been caught. I think Mark has a point too....The first time I got to a final round I did the same...bragged about it to my friends and they asked me what site it was and they would vote for me. I told them NO that would not be fair and did not tell them the site name. I have since learned not to brag. I don't need the extra pats on the back. My confidence in my photography has greatly improved by learning so much here. I don't need to win to feel I have done something worth printing.
I can appreciate the agony that Kerry went through having to make such a difficult decision. Its really a shame she had to go through that, I feel bad for her more than I do for not getting to see results and all.
Ah...wow! I go to bed after work and wake up to find out something like this! And now I'm sorry I got on my soapbox about all of the smileys cause now there are quite a few I'd like to use. <--- (Not one of them )
I am somewhat new to DGrin having only been around since February (I think), and am very saddened to see this happen. When I read that the results would be delayed, to me that meant either a) there was a problem with the server, or b) something like this.
Having designed a couple of websites, I know that servers and websites track everything under the sun. And it's damn-near impossible to do anything without leaving a "fingerprint". I'm sure they know who is responsible. I don't think it was just friends of an entrant trying to make sure their friend won. It sounds like a lot of votes came from one IP address which is easy enough to cross-reference with who submitted an entry or even who has ever lurked, registered, etc on this website since the very beginning. So I'm sure they know who is responsible, and I hope their username has been banned from DGrin. I'm not sure you can ban the person...they can simply register a new username.
If that username has been banned, then we will all eventually know who was banned because that person won't be around anymore. And that's easy enough to do. Just start a new DSS#27 Thread entitled: It Wasn't Me. All the entrants reply to the thread and whoever didn't..well.
I think we should all be able to see the results...no matter if the entry in question is still in the top 5. No matter how you look at it, the final vote is still a big part of C&C in its own rite. I was estatic (and still am) to see that my entry was good enough to make it to the finals! I am not ashamed to say that I worked hard on my entry, and I want to see how it ranked. Maybe Kerry could PM each of the finalists and say this is how many votes yours received and it was ranked # (whatever).
I can understand not wanting to reveal who the entrant in question is. It leads me to believe that there isn't enough "evidence" to clearly show that that entrant had a hand in what happened. But if there is enough, I think everybody has a right to know who it is. If you play the cheating game and get caught, then suffer the consequences.
In terms of the voting system...I know that it is open to all DGrinners, but what about only letting those that submitted an entry into the current challenge vote? Obviously, they wouldn't be able to vote for their own entry, but it would eliminate this kind of thing from happening. I'm not familiar with how the Mega-Challenge system works, but that too sounds better as well.
I don't know...I'm just at a loss right now. I do congrats Kerry and the others for the tough decision that was made. I just don't know what else to say (the above rant not-withstanding <img src="https://us.v-cdn.net/6029383/emoji/rolleyes1.gif" border="0" alt="" > )
I think Mark has a point too....The first time I got to a final round I did the same...bragged about it to my friends and they asked me what site it was and they would vote for me.
This is why I wasn't comfortable DQ'ing a single entry. We can't confirm this was done with any ill intent whatsoever. So no torches or pitchforks. It happened. We've reminded folks that it shouldn't. And the challenges lurch forward once more, with more fodder on how we might continue to improve them.
This is why I wasn't comfortable DQ'ing a single entry. We can't confirm this was done with any ill intent whatsoever. So no torches or pitchforks. It happened. We've reminded folks that it shouldn't. And the challenges lurch forward once more, with more fodder on how we might continue to improve them.
Fair enough. Does entrant even know it happened to his/her entry (if we assume no ill intent)?
Wow, stay gone for a evening and a morning and see what you miss around here...
I have to admit, I had to go and look through the entries again. I can't even remember which I finally decided on because they were all so good. Every one of them, had a shot at at least a top 5... so, I am just amazed. I can't imagine anyone doing this on purpose.
:soapbox
so, to the person...
If you didn't intend for this to happen, I know you feel lousy and probably guilty. I know it would make me sick.
If you did intend to pad the vote, Shame on you. The photographers on here have worked hard to come up with their images. Worked very hard to get to the finals and shouldn't have to miss out because of one person's greed.
Kerry, I am so sorry you are having to deal with all that you have had thrown at you. You are doing a great job and your fairness is beyond generous. Not all of us would have been so kind. Thank you for all you do.
Shame on you, naughty voters :patch - for some this may be all about winning, but for many involved (I would like to think MOST), it's about learning, sharing, and growing while having a few laughs along the way. Punto.
This is why I wasn't comfortable DQ'ing a single entry. We can't confirm this was done with any ill intent whatsoever. So no torches or pitchforks. It happened. We've reminded folks that it shouldn't. And the challenges lurch forward once more, with more fodder on how we might continue to improve them.
Kerry, you once again demonstrate grace under fire. Kudos to you for handling the mucky end of an often-thankless job elegantly, and know that your time, patience and fairness are appreciated.
Kerry, I am so sorry you are having to deal with all that you have had thrown at you. You are doing a great job and your fairness is beyond generous. Not all of us would have been so kind. Thank you for all you do.
And I know it's been said, but I don't think I said it...
THANK YOU, KERRY!!
For all your hard work and for dealing with issues like this! I certainly wouldn't have handled it as graciously as you have were I in your shoes!
Boy...of all the rounds I missed I'm glad it was this one! Sad though...there was too many really good submissions. I hope it can be worked out and it will come to pass because the challenges are a really good way to learn.:cry I often treated it like homework. I hope that whatever, however, and whomever did it was out of innocent ignorance.
Sigh.....
Frustrating as this is.. I really have to commend Kerry for finding a way to deal with the anomaly that allowed the challenges to continue. Thank you Kerry for hanging in there and taking the extra time to deal with this. I personally am happy that we at least still have a DSS challenges to continue on with.
My original agreement with Aaron that the votes should be public was on the surface seemingly a good idea but then later comments stated that knowing who voted for who would possibly create its own set of challenges and favoritism and patting on the back syndrome. All this is makes sense and based on that the way we have it set up right now does seem to work very well except for the most recent incident.
I am sad that we will not know the official results but very happy that we can still play together in this great sandbox called DSS.
Fair enough. Does entrant even know it happened to his/her entry (if we assume no ill intent)?
I've received a very honest and valid explanation for the anomalies, and it makes total sense. Honest error, no ill intent, just some overzealous supporters. It doesn't change the outcome or resulting decision, but know that it won't be happening in future rounds.
And I agree with all the comments that YOU ROCK Kerry!
Now, as for all the talk about brownies during the past several weeks, let me sum it up - this is the BEST brownie recipe EVER - PERIOD. My wife has tried dozens of recipes over the years, and this is THE BEST recipe. I promise. I really do. For all the purists out there - this is it. It's a lot of work, it makes a huge batch, but I'll let you in on a secret (after they've cooled completely overnight, you can cut the brownies, wrap them individually in plastic wrap, and bundle them in a freezer bag and plop them in the freezer. Instant relief for chocolate emergencies. Really people, this is the best recipe!
I'm thinking a vat of Ben & Jerry's will be my dinner tonight...
As a footnote to all this, I did want to remind people about this great post from our previous fearless leader, Greensquared, about the etiquette of public voting. It's linked in the official sticky at the top of this forum, but we've had an influx of new participants (welcome! ) who may not have clicked on every single link in there, so I figure a brief reminder couldn't hurt.
The comment I saw from you before it was deleted, congratulated a winner.
miskatonic_university : I did congratulate a winner so it makes sense it went away. I'm still eager for the new results - even with the no earnings and whatnot.
So that's why my comment went away. I was so eager to see the results. :cry
I really don't know what else to say but to voice my disappointment. Such a good round.
===============================================
Kat:
uh yeah,, excuse me for being curious.. but I just have to ask miskatonic_university.........>>> I too saw your comment before it was deleted and it "was congratulating a specific person for already winning".. This was before the voting results were even announced.. Came back to the board and it was gone.. As a matter of fact, that post had me looking all over the board trying to find the poll results because I had assumed i had missed them.... so I am very curious....................... if you don't mind me asking.. that is..
Comments
Hey!!! I'm not a butler!!!!
Oh... wait...
SmugMug QA
My Photos
It was Kat in the kitchen with a wrench.
Or was it divamum in the conservatory with a lead pipe?
Or was it hoofclix in the ballroom with a rope?
I say it was AaronNelson in the darkroom with a Canon Rebel....
http://lrichters.smugmug.com
fwiw, top five from the last DSS (whom are now qual in the mega are the judges for the next DSS ... using the same system as the mega challenge...
that would get ride of the two judge system now in place which i protested from the beginning...
eitherway of what you decide to do Kerry...im still here to grow....
The first time I got an image to the judging round, I (naturally) bragged about it to all my non-dgrin friends-- who immediately wanted to sign up so they could vote. I discouraged that behavior quite successfully (only one vote!) but I understand the natural inclination to want to help out a friend by voting. I doubt that whoever cast the votes even knew they were doing wrong.
The solution, in my mind, is either to explicitly spell out who is allowed to vote, or find entrants who don't have any friends. (UNpopular Photography?)
Sorry for the lack of smileys, I'm just not in the mood today.
EDIT: Fixed linky.
Had to pop in and say this, had to say something, in fact, because I was getting nervous about being one of the finalists, and being relatively new around here, and thinking you guys must all be wondering who did it. I got no candlesticks here!
ackdoc.com
No friends here!
I'm still not happy until I know I got zero votes in the poll...
I can guarantee you got at least one.
I can see that happening.
Basking in the shadows of yesterday's triumphs'.
So that's why my comment went away. I was so eager to see the results. :cry
I really don't know what else to say but to voice my disappointment. Such a good round.
The comment I saw from you before it was deleted, congratulated a winner.
I can appreciate the agony that Kerry went through having to make such a difficult decision. Its really a shame she had to go through that, I feel bad for her more than I do for not getting to see results and all.
I am somewhat new to DGrin having only been around since February (I think), and am very saddened to see this happen. When I read that the results would be delayed, to me that meant either a) there was a problem with the server, or b) something like this.
Having designed a couple of websites, I know that servers and websites track everything under the sun. And it's damn-near impossible to do anything without leaving a "fingerprint". I'm sure they know who is responsible. I don't think it was just friends of an entrant trying to make sure their friend won. It sounds like a lot of votes came from one IP address which is easy enough to cross-reference with who submitted an entry or even who has ever lurked, registered, etc on this website since the very beginning. So I'm sure they know who is responsible, and I hope their username has been banned from DGrin. I'm not sure you can ban the person...they can simply register a new username.
If that username has been banned, then we will all eventually know who was banned because that person won't be around anymore. And that's easy enough to do. Just start a new DSS#27 Thread entitled: It Wasn't Me. All the entrants reply to the thread and whoever didn't..well.
I think we should all be able to see the results...no matter if the entry in question is still in the top 5. No matter how you look at it, the final vote is still a big part of C&C in its own rite. I was estatic (and still am) to see that my entry was good enough to make it to the finals! I am not ashamed to say that I worked hard on my entry, and I want to see how it ranked. Maybe Kerry could PM each of the finalists and say this is how many votes yours received and it was ranked # (whatever).
I can understand not wanting to reveal who the entrant in question is. It leads me to believe that there isn't enough "evidence" to clearly show that that entrant had a hand in what happened. But if there is enough, I think everybody has a right to know who it is. If you play the cheating game and get caught, then suffer the consequences.
In terms of the voting system...I know that it is open to all DGrinners, but what about only letting those that submitted an entry into the current challenge vote? Obviously, they wouldn't be able to vote for their own entry, but it would eliminate this kind of thing from happening. I'm not familiar with how the Mega-Challenge system works, but that too sounds better as well.
I don't know...I'm just at a loss right now. I do congrats Kerry and the others for the tough decision that was made. I just don't know what else to say (the above rant not-withstanding <img src="https://us.v-cdn.net/6029383/emoji/rolleyes1.gif" border="0" alt="" > )
www.bf2015.smugmug.com
This is why I wasn't comfortable DQ'ing a single entry. We can't confirm this was done with any ill intent whatsoever. So no torches or pitchforks. It happened. We've reminded folks that it shouldn't. And the challenges lurch forward once more, with more fodder on how we might continue to improve them.
Fair enough. Does entrant even know it happened to his/her entry (if we assume no ill intent)?
www.bf2015.smugmug.com
I have to admit, I had to go and look through the entries again. I can't even remember which I finally decided on because they were all so good. Every one of them, had a shot at at least a top 5... so, I am just amazed. I can't imagine anyone doing this on purpose.
:soapbox
so, to the person...
If you didn't intend for this to happen, I know you feel lousy and probably guilty. I know it would make me sick.
If you did intend to pad the vote, Shame on you. The photographers on here have worked hard to come up with their images. Worked very hard to get to the finals and shouldn't have to miss out because of one person's greed.
Kerry, I am so sorry you are having to deal with all that you have had thrown at you. You are doing a great job and your fairness is beyond generous. Not all of us would have been so kind. Thank you for all you do.
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My Photos - Powered by SmugMug!
My Photos - Powered by SmugMug!
Kerry, you once again demonstrate grace under fire. Kudos to you for handling the mucky end of an often-thankless job elegantly, and know that your time, patience and fairness are appreciated.
And I know it's been said, but I don't think I said it...
THANK YOU, KERRY!!
For all your hard work and for dealing with issues like this! I certainly wouldn't have handled it as graciously as you have were I in your shoes!
SmugMug QA
My Photos
Frustrating as this is.. I really have to commend Kerry for finding a way to deal with the anomaly that allowed the challenges to continue. Thank you Kerry for hanging in there and taking the extra time to deal with this. I personally am happy that we at least still have a DSS challenges to continue on with.
My original agreement with Aaron that the votes should be public was on the surface seemingly a good idea but then later comments stated that knowing who voted for who would possibly create its own set of challenges and favoritism and patting on the back syndrome. All this is makes sense and based on that the way we have it set up right now does seem to work very well except for the most recent incident.
I am sad that we will not know the official results but very happy that we can still play together in this great sandbox called DSS.
Thank you again Kerry for all your hard work!
I've received a very honest and valid explanation for the anomalies, and it makes total sense. Honest error, no ill intent, just some overzealous supporters. It doesn't change the outcome or resulting decision, but know that it won't be happening in future rounds.
And I agree with all the comments that YOU ROCK Kerry!
www.bf2015.smugmug.com
My Photos - Powered by SmugMug!
As a footnote to all this, I did want to remind people about this great post from our previous fearless leader, Greensquared, about the etiquette of public voting. It's linked in the official sticky at the top of this forum, but we've had an influx of new participants (welcome!
i will join ya....
miskatonic_university : I did congratulate a winner so it makes sense it went away. I'm still eager for the new results - even with the no earnings and whatnot.
So that's why my comment went away. I was so eager to see the results. :cry
I really don't know what else to say but to voice my disappointment. Such a good round.
===============================================
Kat:
uh yeah,, excuse me for being curious.. but I just have to ask miskatonic_university.........>>> I too saw your comment before it was deleted and it "was congratulating a specific person for already winning".. This was before the voting results were even announced.. Came back to the board and it was gone.. As a matter of fact, that post had me looking all over the board trying to find the poll results because I had assumed i had missed them.... so I am very curious....................... if you don't mind me asking.. that is..
Kat