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SM footer link no longer hidden

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    mbonocorembonocore Registered Users Posts: 2,299 Major grins
    edited February 18, 2014
    LPC wrote: »
    Michael how did you make the 'Powered by Smugmug' text so small on your site? It is much smaller than the default on everyone else's. How did you do that?

    It is using your theme's font. Some fonts have smaller default sizing. I am using PT Sans Narrow.
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    mishenkamishenka Banned Posts: 470 Major grins
    edited February 18, 2014
    mbonocore wrote: »
    You are most welcome. While DGrin is a great way for users to interact and help each other, I like popping in and hearing your opinions and feedback. You guys do contribute alot to the product decisions, actually.

    OMG - I really want to know who, what post(s), whos opinion here on DGrin "helped" you to come up with the decision to persist SmugMug's advertisement and link on your customer's pages?

    Well, please, allow me help you with a product decision that will MAKE YOU NAME and MORE MONEY! Design Client's Log-in Content Box!!!!!!! You are either totally blind over there or ignorant - this feature alone would put you over Zenfolio big time. Well, that is, of course, after you stop displaying SM advertisement on your customers' pages.
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    mbonocorembonocore Registered Users Posts: 2,299 Major grins
    edited February 18, 2014
    mishenka wrote: »
    OMG - I really want to know who, what post(s), whos opinion here on DGrin "helped" you to come up with the decision to persist SmugMug's advertisement and link on your customer's pages?

    Well, please, allow me help you with a product decision that will MAKE YOU NAME and MORE MONEY! Design Client's Log-in Content Box!!!!!!! You are either totally blind over there or ignorant - this feature alone would put you over Zenfolio big time. Well, that is, of course, after you stop displaying SM advertisement on your customers' pages.

    Michael,

    You are WAY off base if you think DGrin users input doesn't have any impact in product decisions.

    Here are just a couple that I was able to get done with the strong feedback from the DGrin community.


    Remove the 255 keyword list limit
    Allow selection of a larger size for collage style galleries
    Additional Gallery Design Options
    PayPal Check Out
    Scope Search
    Restore Bulk Collecting
    Add a Google Badge Content Block
    Random Slideshow Order
    Allow true full screen background slideshow
    Randomly chosen background image
    Share/Get a Link needs original link if originals enabled
    Restore Map This
    Linked In Social Icon
    Add Adsense Content Block
    Show Filenames in Organizer
    Add Google Calendar
    Add Wufoo Content Block

    Will every single thing you request make the cut? No. But we surely don't ignore you.
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    mishenkamishenka Banned Posts: 470 Major grins
    edited February 18, 2014
    Michael, you are pretty active today here:) I feel that something is cooking (it's a good thing I hope). I do, by the way, realize how much you have achieved here during all this time. Trust me - I do. I also do know (it's my job) what it takes to make the list you showed go through. I do. But the funny thing is, sometimes, we are remembered, mostly, by the negative things more than by the positive things we do... (psychology 101 if you will). 17 big items are listed above. Who will know or remember them - no one. People, new potential clients will look at them and think that ALL of them "just must be there", all these things are taken for granted by people who are in the market for the online portfolio/store services. But wait a second, the moment these people hear "no direct client login?", "their branding on MY wedding gallery?!" - that will be the moment YOU LOST A CUSTOMER. Sorry, Michael, I am not trying to have another Freudian discussion with you - I am past this point. I simply wanted to assure you that I truly realize and appreciate ALL you and your team were able to achieve (even if I do not care about some of the features). I bow to you and applaud you. Now, please, get your branding/logo/advertisement off customer's page as it is advertised on your website.
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    HidyHoHidyHo Registered Users Posts: 3 Beginner grinner
    edited February 19, 2014
    Just noticed this on my smugmug site and just did a google search and found this.

    It's complete BS, like others have pointed out, SM blatantly says on their site that there is no advertising or anything on their paid versions. I was always under the impression I could control their entire look and feel.

    Do you know if any of SM's competitors have a conversion tool? My only problem is all the data in my existing account. I'd gladly move to another product now if they offered a tool to help make the switch over.
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    HidyHoHidyHo Registered Users Posts: 3 Beginner grinner
    edited February 19, 2014
    One thing everyone should be aware of is the impact that link will have if you're doing any SEO work on your site.

    This advertisement with the link out to smugmug could in fact harm your own search engine rank, causing your site to be pushed down in google and other SE's.

    More outbound links on your site could cause a drop in link juice = lower rank for you.
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    HidyHoHidyHo Registered Users Posts: 3 Beginner grinner
    edited February 19, 2014
    Has anyone tried to get a refund yet?
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    mishenkamishenka Banned Posts: 470 Major grins
    edited February 19, 2014
    HidyHo wrote: »
    Has anyone tried to get a refund yet?

    I have not tried it yet - I have two accounts with them. Honestly, I do not think it would be difficult at all, simply ask, in writing. They might be happy to refund just to keep you quiet:) However, I personally believe that refund is a way too easy way out for SmugMug at this point, otherwise I would have requested it a long while ago. The more customers chime in on this issue - the more chances we will be able to legally fight this issue. You are correct: they sold you a promise that they never kept.

    I am not aware of any migration tools. Doubt any exist. Just rebuild the site on other service provider platform.
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    pilotdavepilotdave Registered Users Posts: 785 Major grins
    edited February 19, 2014
    There are migration tools available, but it's not exactly a smooth process. I opened a zenfolio trial a while back and used a migration tool to move everything over. The big issue for me is that captions and keywords created on smugmug are not added to the image metadata so they don't transfer over. Captions and keywords added prior to upload do transfer. Also every smugmug folder ended up inside a single zenfolio folder. Not sure how hard it was going to be to bring them out. Never bothered trying. I also had an issue that not everything migrated... can't remember why. The lack of captions and keywords and zenfolio's interface killed the idea for me. I'm stuck with smugmug, and they're stuck with me. Some of my biggest complaints about New smug's interface are the same or worse at zenfolio. But if my captions and keywords had transferred, I probably would have deleted dgrin from my bookmarks months ago.

    Too me, it's not so much that smugmug is bad. It's that it used to be better. We're paying more for less. My legacy site has a whole big smugmug footer. That never bothered me much. I just don't like the direction smugmug has gone and seems to be heading at a faster and faster pace.

    Dave
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    OffTopicOffTopic Registered Users Posts: 521 Major grins
    edited February 19, 2014
    rich56k wrote: »
    As if this isn't bad enough (see all above comments) the pages load so slow that virtually every page /gallery you click on is initially blank except for the "footer" showing briefly (but blatantly) at the TOP OF THE PAGE.


    This is still an issue for me, every page initially loads as a blank page with Powered by SmugMug before the page content loads. Not cool at all.

    What bugs me more than anything else is having the layout of my site affected without warning and finding out by surprise when a I log in and find things all messed up or a client says something. This change created a huge gap between MY footer and the SM footer. Did the best I could to close it up but it still looks ridiculous.

    I/we should not have to lurk in this forum all day long every day to know what changes are being made to our sites. I've been complaining about this lack of communication for over a year now. Two weeks ago there was a bug that only allowed twelve images to show in a gallery and no one ever bothered to respond to my ticket to let me know when it was finally fixed. I had to stumble across it here in the forum. Then I log in and found this mess a few days ago. I wasn't going to post anything once it was changed to Powered by SmugMug (if it had been left at Photo Sharing by SmugMug I would have cancelled my account immediately), but ...
    Too me, it's not so much that smugmug is bad. It's that it used to be better. We're paying more for less... I just don't like the direction smugmug has gone and seems to be heading at a faster and faster pace.

    Exactly that, and a poor attitude about it. We're six months into this, SmugMug can't use a "rollout" as an excuse any more. I agreed to pay double what I had been paying, I tried to be patient and give SM time to work things out but at this point I feel like it's been nothing but aggravation and bad surprises on my end.
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    3PCo3PCo Registered Users Posts: 65 Big grins
    edited February 19, 2014
    Free file transfer service
    HidyHo wrote: »
    Just noticed this on my smugmug site and just did a google search and found this.

    It's complete BS, like others have pointed out, SM blatantly says on their site that there is no advertising or anything on their paid versions. I was always under the impression I could control their entire look and feel.

    Do you know if any of SM's competitors have a conversion tool? My only problem is all the data in my existing account. I'd gladly move to another product now if they offered a tool to help make the switch over.

    Check out https://www.uploadjunction.com/home/faq
    They do free file transfers from one photosite to another, all in the cloud without tying up your computer. I am probably leaving over this as well, and I discovered them after looking over Zenfolio. They give you a discount at ZF, too.
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    AdamNPAdamNP Registered Users Posts: 178 Major grins
    edited February 19, 2014
    I can't believe this still isn't being addressed by SM's higher ups. As others have pointed out, this could very easily be made a legal issue for breach of contract/false advertising. It's probably the stupidest decision SM has ever made, especially since competitors freely allow branding removal.

    I'm glad someone else pointed out the SEO issues too. Not only are we providing backlinks to SM, to their benefit, but the huge amount of outgoing links from our side can and does hurt our ranking. We all know how horrible new SM is for SEO anyway, the last thing we need is another negative that could be easily fixed.

    I.. personally.. would be OK with "Portions copyright SM" with the text DELINKED. My site should contain no external links anywhere that I don't place there myself. And the fact that clicking the link takes people away from our site? And not even in a new tab? You have GOT to be kidding. If I was a serious pro, that one factor alone would make me instantly cancel.

    Someone, who has answers, and who can make real changes, now, needs to reply. Now.
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    denisegoldbergdenisegoldberg Administrators Posts: 14,245 moderator
    edited February 19, 2014
    interesting...
    I just found that CSS again works to remove "Powered by SmugMug".

    will the option stay? assuming it will, thanks!

    Funny, I wouldn't mind the tag line if I could position it (as I could initially) and if it was only text, not an active link. As other posters have said, I don't want links leading away from my site.

    --- Denise
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    mishenkamishenka Banned Posts: 470 Major grins
    edited February 19, 2014
    interesting...
    I just found that CSS again works to remove "Powered by SmugMug".

    will the option stay? assuming it will, thanks!

    Funny, I wouldn't mind the tag line if I could position it (as I could initially) and if it was only text, not an active link. As other posters have said, I don't want links leading away from my site.

    --- Denise

    interesting indeed... It's hard to say which way it is going:) Regular (big) footer still has the inline style enforcement while the Small Footer is inline style-free. I guess will wait and see and, maybe, hear anyone's word.
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    SunGloSunGlo Registered Users Posts: 382 Major grins
    edited February 19, 2014
    interesting...
    I just found that CSS again works to remove "Powered by SmugMug".

    will the option stay? assuming it will, thanks!

    Funny, I wouldn't mind the tag line if I could position it (as I could initially) and if it was only text, not an active link. As other posters have said, I don't want links leading away from my site.

    --- Denise


    It's gone from my site also. One less thing for me to worry about as they could change the wording anytime the mood strikes them...hope it stays that way. The scary thing is the same person that came up with the idea to begin with is probably still employed by SM and sitting in a back room saying "Hey, why don't we change..."

    Phil
    .
    SunGlo Photography
    www.sunglophoto.com
    ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
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    GuthriePhotographyGuthriePhotography Registered Users Posts: 12 Big grins
    edited February 19, 2014
    Did smugmug remove the footer all together because it is no longer on my site at all??
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    AdamNPAdamNP Registered Users Posts: 178 Major grins
    edited February 19, 2014
    Definitely still on mine.

    And while hiding with CSS again is back to what has been status quo for years, IMO it's not really acceptable, mainly because

    A) it still violates the no ads/spam promise, you shouldn't have to apply a CSS hack to get what you paid for
    B) hiding with CSS still leaves the SEO issues, because the link is still in the code

    This is what happens when you don't obey the classic wisdom of "let sleeping dogs lie". Everyone was accepting of the unofficial ways to fix things ourselves, but this ridiculous and intrusive action has made a whole lot more people aware of it. I think it needs to be gone for good, and made a feature of Portfolio/Business accounts (just like Zenfolio). It should be an option to just check a box and have it gone.
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    mishenkamishenka Banned Posts: 470 Major grins
    edited February 19, 2014
    AdamNP wrote: »
    Definitely still on mine.

    And while hiding with CSS again is back to what has been status quo for years, IMO it's not really acceptable, mainly because

    A) it still violates the no ads/spam promise, you shouldn't have to apply a CSS hack to get what you paid for
    B) hiding with CSS still leaves the SEO issues, because the link is still in the code

    This is what happens when you don't obey the classic wisdom of "let sleeping dogs lie". Everyone was accepting of the unofficial ways to fix things ourselves, but this ridiculous and intrusive action has made a whole lot more people aware of it. I think it needs to be gone for good, and made a feature of Portfolio/Business accounts (just like Zenfolio). It should be an option to just check a box and have it gone.

    Absolutely agree. I, for one, am not accepting half-ass solution anymore: too late guys, you woke me up:) First time around I stopped at simply writing a blog on my site. This time it escalates a bit higher. I am kindly asking to provide the service you promised me at the time of sale. If the previously offered service changed then update your website to reflect it: remove the following from your pages:


    SMfooter_v2_01.jpg

    SMfooter_v2_03.jpg

    SMfooter_v2_02.jpg
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    DanCarl97DanCarl97 Registered Users Posts: 139 Major grins
    edited February 20, 2014
    Yes, I'd like to see a proper way to remove it so that there is no effect on SEO or the like however I'm at least glad Smugmug has given us the option to remove it and not prevented it.
    Did smugmug remove the footer all together because it is no longer on my site at all??

    No, you'll most likely still have the old code to hide the footer somewhere in your site so that now works again.
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    LPCLPC Registered Users Posts: 481 Major grins
    edited February 20, 2014
    I will always be uneasy when recommending or visiting my site until we get some sort of official confirmation of this. They seem to have backtracked for now but is this just temporary until they can decide how big the irreversible watermark should be? Am I going to visit my site tomorrow and find that they have come up with another way of branding it? I just have a horrible feeling that this isn't over yet :uhoh
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    thenickdudethenickdude Registered Users Posts: 1,302 Major grins
    edited February 20, 2014
    Well, I suppose there's always the possibility that SmugMug have removed the blocking while they work on making the footer not appear until the rest of the page is completely loaded...
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    LPCLPC Registered Users Posts: 481 Major grins
    edited February 20, 2014
    That's what I'm worried about. And based on pretty much everything else they do, we know that there won't be an announcement - it will just happen - today, tomorrow, maybe next week maybe in a few months. And the next 'solution' could be even worse!
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    DanCarl97DanCarl97 Registered Users Posts: 139 Major grins
    edited February 20, 2014
    LPC wrote: »
    That's what I'm worried about. And based on pretty much everything else they do, we know that there won't be an announcement - it will just happen - today, tomorrow, maybe next week maybe in a few months. And the next 'solution' could be even worse!

    Exactly my thinking. Where's the change log? Where's the communication between the business and the client???
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    AdamNPAdamNP Registered Users Posts: 178 Major grins
    edited February 20, 2014
    DanCarl97 wrote: »
    Exactly my thinking. Where's the change log? Where's the communication between the business and the client???

    It's amazing isn't it? SM used to be one of the most customer-friendly companies I had ever dealt with. While feature development and such was glacial, as we all know, they actually talked to us. The support was lightning fast and generally helpful. Now, obviously very important issues are left in silence, things that rate about a 1 out of 100 on the priority list are routinely completed, and things that are red flag showstoppers are ignored.

    And, btw, since I know the reply is coming - mbonocore, this is not your fault. You are one person, and I actually feel terrible for you. You are left to come here and defend outrageous decisions, total inaction, and the deafening silence from SM over critical issues, flaws, and just horrible design and PR decisions. Don't say it's your fault. It's not. It's the 100% reversal of SM's entire company attitude and strategy. I've seen it happen with many online companies, but it's a tragedy every time. And I really thought SM might be able to stay away from it.

    But I guess not. RIP to old SM, we loved you guys. I even applied for years on end to become a hero. I couldn't do that job now even if it was offered, regardless of pay. I can't defend the indefensible.
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    CharlyCharly Registered Users Posts: 86 Big grins
    edited February 20, 2014
    The footer is now gone from my site, but it's a little too late sm.... I'm still leaving, no renewal for me. Actually it shouldn't have been put there at all, especially without discussing it with your customers first. Or at the very least giving us a heads up it was coming would've been appropriate. Your business practices have a lot to be desired anymore... Remember your customers are your bread and butter on many levels? Seems not.

    There's just too many things that I believe take away from my business with y'all and in some instances make my site look unprofessional. Now that I'm in WP, I've got more in depth stat counts. Not just on images, but pretty much everything; where in the world people are viewing my site from, to what display size, what device and even to how long their visit was, etc. Don't recollect the option to use anything like that on here. All my meta titles are as they should be with spaces where they belong (though will tweak them a bit more) and only my business name is anywhere to be found; not WP or anything else.

    My self fulfillment ordering, shopping cart and checkout are clean looking, easy to use and I will keep all the profits. Plus I can use the best printers in my area without needing to edit per anyone's ICC profile. That alone is a biggie for me!

    I wish everyone who stays with sm much luck! And sm, everyone will know my feelings about your business and my suggestion to stay clear....
    www.ImagerybyCharly.com | Serving the DFW area of Texas and beyond
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    3PCo3PCo Registered Users Posts: 65 Big grins
    edited February 20, 2014
    I have to say it was more fun beating the code myself. But I agree that this seeming capitulation leaves most issues unresolved. For me, the major one is the failure to inform. These people are not trying to be business partners.
    I moved my stuff to Zenfolio for a trial, using the Uploader website. It was seamless, even the Collection links transferred smoothly. Of course I have to re-do individual pages, re-write some stuff. Not sure if I'll complete the move or not, but I wouldn't even be looking if SM walked their own talk.
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    BaldyBaldy Registered Users, Super Moderators Posts: 2,853 moderator
    edited February 20, 2014
    Hey everyone,

    I'm very sorry for the confusion about this. Please feel free to blame me for not being focused on it, not our heroes or Bonocore. And my apologies for not understanding how important this issue is to many of you. True confession: I've only read through the last two pages of this thread and, unless my memory fails me (very possible), I don't remember talking to a customer about the footer in all the years I've worked here.

    I have known there were requests and threads about it but, for better or worse, I didn't focus on it because it felt like I should focus on issues that affect millions and in my mind this didn't feel like one of those.

    Honestly, my understanding of what happened a few days ago is an engineer made a fix that caused the css you use to hide the footer to not work anymore. Since we don't provide an official way in the system to remove the footer, like a setting in a control panel, or an option you pay for, a number of you came to depend on css to hide it.

    When Bonocore approached me about it yesterday, I suggested that we just roll back the change that was made the other day so you can carry on until we can focus on it and have an official solution, like an option in the settings, or whatever.

    I have more to say but I have to run to meetings for a few hours. But I'll be back this afternoon.

    Thanks,
    Baldy
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    RKnechtRKnecht Registered Users Posts: 366 Major grins
    edited February 20, 2014
    Thank you for the response Baldy. As a long time Smugmug member, I appreciate all the work that goes into keeping my site up and running day after day. I'm not a complainer by nature, as I most often have more important things to worry about. My main issue is that we were not informed of this change which made the footer reappear. Another issue I had was that if you clicked on it, you LEFT my site, no new tab appeared. I redid the code and the footer is gone again, which I am thankful for. I simply don't have the time, or want, to move my stuff elsewhere. I have come to appreciate the excellent service i, and more importantly, my customers receive.

    In my opinion, a Pro user should not have any other branding on their site but their own. I can go into detail about why I feel strongly about that, but would prefer to do it via PM or Email rather than discussing it here. Again, I am a "happy camper" and hope to be a member when my sales hit 20,000 and beyond.
    A few Nikon bodies and some fast Nikon glass

    www.richknechtphotography.com
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    aschendelaschendel Registered Users Posts: 283 Major grins
    edited February 20, 2014
    Baldy wrote: »
    Honestly, my understanding of what happened a few days ago is an engineer made a fix that caused the css you use to hide the footer to not work anymore. Since we don't provide an official way in the system to remove the footer, like a setting in a control panel, or an option you pay for, a number of you came to depend on css to hide it.

    To be clear, the change wasn't accidental, it was explicit and aggressive (from my fairly well-educated perspective). The fix didn't break the CSS work-around, it directly targeted those of us hiding it. I can only assume (hope!) that type of focused change is done with some degree of oversight and planning and I believe that may be what caused some hackles to rise.

    Thank you for getting it rolled back for the time-being.

    Andy
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