I'm shooting a Wedding Advice please

98olds · February 2, 2010

Hi,

I know in a previous post all of you were trying to talk me out of photographing weddings, and you did.... Well until I got a call today asking if I would be interested in shooting a wedding.

Its at a Holiday inn in June, I dont have many details right now but.. What should I expect, and how should i go about setting this up. The woman i talked to on the phone earlier says she cant afford a "Professional Photographer" and I use that term loosely, because I consider myself fairly good... Good enough to get her what she wants, and then some.

She is going to pay me, She doesnt want an album or anything all she says is "I want to just take the photos to Cvs and print them"

How much should I charge her for my time, and services? I'd be there working from 11-5pm

Any suggestions? Any key things that I'm missing?
Thanks for any help you can provide me with.

SimpsonBrothers · February 2, 2010

I use this:

http://weddings.about.com/od/photographer/a/Photogchecklist.htm

Qarik · February 2, 2010

if she is friend and just wants an edited set of digitals and you are a beginner. *throws dart* $500.

btw do you have flash? do you have a back up body? do you have editing SW?

98olds · February 2, 2010

Qarik wrote:

if she is friend and just wants an edited set of digitals and you are a beginner. *throws dart* $500.

btw do you have flash? do you have a back up body? do you have editing SW?

I have Flash, Im using a Nikon D40X, but unfortunatly do not have a back up SLR so My back up is my powershot... Which ive had fantastic luck with...

And yes I have editing software. Adobe CS4

I am not a beginner at photography, but this is the first Wedding I will be photographing. $500 sounds like a reasonable price, but is there anything I need to know towards the business end of things?

Moogle Pepper · February 2, 2010

98olds wrote:

I have Flash, Im using a Nikon D40X, but unfortunatly do not have a back up SLR so My back up is my powershot... Which ive had fantastic luck with...

And yes I have editing software. Adobe CS4

I am not a beginner at photography, but this is the first Wedding I will be photographing. $500 sounds like a reasonable price, but is there anything I need to know towards the business end of things?

contract, among other things.

98olds · February 2, 2010

Moogle Pepper wrote:

contract, among other things.

ok so any suggestions of what should be in the contract?
And again thank you to all of you that have responded.

urbanaries · February 2, 2010

98olds wrote:

ok so any suggestions of what should be in the contract?
And again thank you to all of you that have responded.

I would take some time to read posts that are in the Sticky section of this forum, and then bring specific questions back here. People have taken the time to gather this information for your benefit

Best post to start:
http://www.dgrin.com/showpost.php?p=745166&postcount=1

And the Sticky of Wedding photography Resources: http://www.dgrin.com/showpost.php?p=745166&postcount=1

sweet caroline · February 2, 2010

The contract should at least spell out expectations of what you will deliver, a release for them to make prints, and payment dates. Check sales tax laws for your state. You may need to get a permit to collect them. In Texas, we are required to collect taxes, but it's super easy to apply for the permit online and file online.

Caroline

Scott_Quier · February 3, 2010

98olds wrote:

I have Flash, Im using a Nikon D40X, but unfortunatly do not have a back up SLR so My back up is my powershot... Which ive had fantastic luck with...

And yes I have editing software. Adobe CS4

I am not a beginner at photography, but this is the first Wedding I will be photographing. $500 sounds like a reasonable price, but is there anything I need to know towards the business end of things?

OK, this is going to sound like I'm just beating you up and being nasty - so be prepared!

Photographing a wedding is not about luck. There is no luck. You can't rely on luck. You have to KNOW what you are doing, what to expect, be prepared for the expected, and KNOW HOW TO HANDLE THE UNEXPECTED!. That all comes with experience.
Your powershot is not a backup camera. It MIGHT qualify as a 3rd or 4th stringer. Your D40 MIGHT qualify as a backup camera but that camera is soooo limited in so many ways.
Contracts - first, IANAL, but you can find all sorts of contracts on the web. Take bits and pieces and cobble something together that makes you happy. Then, pay the bucks and take that to a real lawyer for his/her opinion and advice. When/if something goes wrong (thankfully, I've not had this happen ... yet), it is critical that your contract be worded correctly and cover all the bases. Do not work any wedding without a contract! A contract does more than protect you from your client. It protects your client from you. But, it's most important purpose (to my mind at least) is as a tool to concretely, clearly, and unambigiously communicate your expectations (of the client) and your responsibilities to your client. It helps to avoid the, "Well, I thought you were going to do ....." discussions.
"I just want to take the photos to CVS and print them...." Sounds to me like your potential client really doesn't place much value on the photos. Experience has shown this to be one of indicators of a problem waiting to happen. Just be prepared.
Get insurance! Not just for your equipment but for liability and for "errors and omissions". I'm not going to tell you much about this, do some research. Google is your friend.
As recommended by urbanaries - read the stickies at the top of the forum. There is huge amount of excellent information there. I've even contributed a bit - see the link in my signature.
As for payment .... $500 might be a reasonable fee if you had 2 or 3 (or more) such events already in your portfolio. You are expecting payment while, at the same time, using the client's most important day as a learning experience, a workshop. Hmmmmm

I really do wish you every success in this endevor, but I fear you are not adequately prepared

The Mack · February 3, 2010

98olds wrote:

I have Flash, Im using a Nikon D40X, but unfortunatly do not have a back up SLR so My back up is my powershot... Which ive had fantastic luck with...

And yes I have editing software. Adobe CS4

I am not a beginner at photography, but this is the first Wedding I will be photographing. $500 sounds like a reasonable price, but is there anything I need to know towards the business end of things?

In the wedding photography world, you're a beginner. D40x isn't exactly the weapon of choice.

98olds · February 3, 2010

The Mack wrote:

In the wedding photography world, you're a beginner. D40x isn't exactly the weapon of choice.

Its all I have right now. ok.

98olds · February 3, 2010

Scott_Quier wrote:

OK, this is going to sound like I'm just beating you up and being nasty - so be prepared!
Photographing a wedding is not about luck. There is no luck. You can't rely on luck. You have to KNOW what you are doing, what to expect, be prepared for the expected, and KNOW HOW TO HANDLE THE UNEXPECTED!. That all comes with experience.

Your powershot is not a backup camera. It MIGHT qualify as a 3rd or 4th stringer. Your D40 MIGHT qualify as a backup camera but that camera is soooo limited in so many ways.

Contracts - first, IANAL, but you can find all sorts of contracts on the web. Take bits and pieces and cobble something together that makes you happy. Then, pay the bucks and take that to a real lawyer for his/her opinion and advice. When/if something goes wrong (thankfully, I've not had this happen ... yet), it is critical that your contract be worded correctly and cover all the bases. Do not work any wedding without a contract! A contract does more than protect you from your client. It protects your client from you. But, it's most important purpose (to my mind at least) is as a tool to concretely, clearly, and unambigiously communicate your expectations (of the client) and your responsibilities to your client. It helps to avoid the, "Well, I thought you were going to do ....." discussions.

"I just want to take the photos to CVS and print them...." Sounds to me like your potential client really doesn't place much value on the photos. Experience has shown this to be one of indicators of a problem waiting to happen. Just be prepared.

Get insurance! Not just for your equipment but for liability and for "errors and omissions". I'm not going to tell you much about this, do some research. Google is your friend.

As recommended by urbanaries - read the stickies at the top of the forum. There is huge amount of excellent information there. I've even contributed a bit - see the link in my signature.

As for payment .... $500 might be a reasonable fee if you had 2 or 3 (or more) such events already in your portfolio. You are expecting payment while, at the same time, using the client's most important day as a learning experience, a workshop. Hmmmmm

I really do wish you every success in this endevor, but I fear you are not adequately prepared

I photographed a Wedding Reception last year... They had gotten Married in Key West Florida but had the reception back home for friends and family. The images came out great using the D40X

I know this isnt the Ideal Camera, but I have to use it. I amd good with dealing with the unexpected It What I do.

i will have to look into making a contract, because that seems to be one thing thats unanimous with all of you.

Oh and im sorry if It came across that I rely on luck, in actuallity I know What I am doing behind a camera, luck is only a little part of it for me.
but if anyone has any suggestions on what I should do please dont hesitate.

Surfdog · February 3, 2010

Dude, I would be petrified to be walking into a wedding job as ill-prepared as you are. Rent, borrow, or buy decent equipment to use as main and back up. Insurance and contracts are available through PPA. Spend the money to join. A word of warning - Once the images leave your hands, you have lost control of the print quality. I would not have my name appear on any images that are going to be printed by the client at CVS, Walgreens, Walmart, etc. If the prints end up looking like crap, your name will be on them for all the friends & family to see.

98olds · February 3, 2010

Surfdog wrote:

Dude, I would be petrified to be walking into a wedding job as ill-prepared as you are. Rent, borrow, or buy decent equipment to use as main and back up. Insurance and contracts are available through PPA. Spend the money to join. A word of warning - Once the images leave your hands, you have lost control of the print quality. I would not have my name appear on any images that are going to be printed by the client at CVS, Walgreens, Walmart, etc. If the prints end up looking like crap, your name will be on them for all the friends & family to see.

The client told me she "Wanted to print them at cvs"

I am going to talk her out of that, because I do not want them printed there.

Now I have to ask.... I love my D40X and think its a fantastic camera.....

Why is everyone telling me its not a good camera?

The Mack · February 3, 2010

98olds wrote:

Its all I have right now. ok.

Then walk away.

The Mack · February 3, 2010

98olds wrote:

The client told me she "Wanted to print them at cvs"

I am going to talk her out of that, because I do not want them printed there.

Now I have to ask.... I love my D40X and think its a fantastic camera.....

Why is everyone telling me its not a good camera?

It's a beginners camera. It's not a wedding photographers camera.

Moogle Pepper · February 4, 2010

The Mack wrote:

It's a beginners camera. It's not a wedding photographers camera.

Well true, but you don't have to have the cream of the crop cameras for it either, though having higher-end cameras does help a lot.

If you are really inclined to do this, rent. I remember seeing that you are not 18, I could be wrong and if I am, I am sorry. Which leads to 2 things, ask your folks if you can rent better gear and read up on the age requirements for working in your state.

bmoreshooter · February 4, 2010

Based on your lack of experience and proper equipment I don't think that you should be charging anything to do this wedding. If you want to offer them some free pictures that you would be willing to shoot as a guest that would be fine. Accepting this as a paying job is a disservice to you and them. Shooting a less than satifactory job will leave a mark on your reputation that could stay with you a very long time. If you shoot as a guest you will take all of the pressure off yourself and you can use this event as a learning opportunity and you just might have some fun. I am really annoyed by brides that will spend thousands on a wedding dress and reception only to claim they can't afford a professional photographer. They will spend more on flowers and tux rentals than they are willind to pay you. OOPS sorry for the rant. I went off track a little. If anything you should be going as an assistant to a wedding photographer for your first job. See how it's done and what's really required to do the job. If you are a "master photographer" with tons of experience then I would be more apt to believe that you could take any old camera and produce an acceptable wedding, but at your level I somehow doubt that this is going to work. I'm sorry if this sounds a bit abrupt but it's how I feel about the subject. I have been a professional photographer for 30 years and I still remember how tough it was to get started, but don't rush. Do the proper ground work and you will be a better professional in the end. BTW if you shoot as a guest you won't need a contract. Best of luck with your decision.

Scott_Quier · February 4, 2010

After looking around here a bit, mostly because of what you said in your first post in this thread, I found this response from jeffreaux2 in another thread. My sense is that nothing material has changed since then - his advice is, as usual, very sound. If you are going to shoot this event then ask the B&G to fund the rental of equipment you need to make this job as easy as possible (or even possible) .... there's a saying, "The photographic equipment you use doesn't make the photograph .... it makes the process of making that difficult photograph possible."

You use Nikon - stick with that, but rent a body and a couple of lenses of a more professional grade. I know Nikon has a couple of low-light/high-ISO monsters that are about as good as anything around. Do some research to find the candidates. Also, rent a couple of professional-grade, Nikon contstant aperture f/2.8 zooms and a good flash. Rent for the week before the wedding so you have time to practice with it and get used to how it works. Do this and you will be set - the rental equipment will by your primary, your D40X will by your back-up.

In an effort to increase your chances of success - you might find it beneficial to start a new thread to get some comment/critique on some of the good and not so good photos from the reception you mention having photographed. Do you have a gallery to which you can point? Failing that, you may want to just attach a couple or three in the new thread. Just a thought.

mercphoto · February 4, 2010

98olds wrote:

Hi,

I know in a previous post all of you were trying to talk me out of photographing weddings, and you did.... Well until I got a call today asking if I would be interested in shooting a wedding.

What has changed? In other words, you were talked out of photographing weddings. Now you're wanting to do this one. What has changed?

zoomer · February 4, 2010

My first paid wedding....I was shooting the group pictures in a church and everything looked great...was using my on camera flash unit with a d200.
As it got darker outside my pictures got darker and I could not figure out how to do anything about it. I just kept shooting and hoped for the best(I did not have the experience/knowledge to figure out and fix the problem)..but my stomach was in my shoes. Well thank god for Raw I was able to salvage them to some extent but they were so grainy..I felt so bad about it. I owe that wedding to where I am today (wherever that is) because it motivated me to improve so that would never happen to me again.

My third paid wedding....I was seconds away from the bride coming down the aisle and my camera just stopped working...I tried all the usual things and could not get it going...the grand parents were coming down the aisle...I RAN to my truck and got my back up camera, I RAN back to the church (luckily my backup camera was all set to go), got back into position the very instant the bride started coming down the aisle. Saved the day.
When I got back out and checked out my main camera..the problem was that the lens had come unclicked from the body, I did not have the experience/knowledge at that time to figure it out quickly.

My very next paid wedding I was using rechargeable batteries in my flash and they overheated and my flash stopped working (I had no idea at the time why my flash stopped working I did not have the knowledge/experience at the time to figure it out)...again I ran to my truck for the backup just in time to catch the bridal party coming down the aisle.

These are true gut wrenching experiences from my first few weddings...there are more experiences I could relate but you get the idea...you can hope for the best....but reality will bite you if you are not prepared.

bmoreshooter · February 4, 2010

Well said Zoomer. Your experiences have such a familiar ring to them. A lot of people wonder why it takes me so long to gear up for a wedding shoot. It's because I take at least 2 of everything and I test it all before I leave my house the day of the wedding.

98olds · February 4, 2010

The Mack wrote:

It's a beginners camera. It's not a wedding photographers camera.

You have to start someplace do you not?

you cant honestly tell me that you started your career with the camera you currently are using now can you?

Scott_Quier · February 4, 2010

98olds wrote:

You have to start someplace do you not?

you cant honestly tell me that you started your career with the camera you currently are using now can you?

I didn't either, but I did start with A PAIR of cameras that were up to the job.

98olds · February 4, 2010

Scott_Quier wrote:

I didn't either, but I did start with A PAIR of cameras that were up to the job.

i will look into rental feels... I am at least looking at renting a Flash, and possible a Wide Angle lens

I plan on sticking with Nikon, I have access to using a Nikon D60, but I have a feeling you all will tell me that that isnt good enough either.

Which Camera would you think I should Rent.

I just got a new job, and am planning on buyin a D300 in the next few months, but do not know if that will be before the wedding in June or not....

Any suggestions on cameras, while sticking with Nikon? I want to be able to use the same lens that I have for the D40X if all possible

The Mack · February 5, 2010

98olds wrote:

You have to start someplace do you not?

you cant honestly tell me that you started your career with the camera you currently are using now can you?

I started with the D50, but I never shot a wedding with it.

I've shot w/ the D200 and D300s that I've rented for weddings. I prolly should have upgraded awhile ago, I outgrew the D200 at least a year ago, when I started weddings. I can get away with a D200 because of lenses and abilities with flash. I'm not the best by far, but I'm capable with my abilities and equipment.

Now, I'm going D300/D700/D3 by the end of the summer.

The Mack · February 5, 2010

98olds wrote:

i will look into rental feels... I am at least looking at renting a Flash, and possible a Wide Angle lens

I plan on sticking with Nikon, I have access to using a Nikon D60, but I have a feeling you all will tell me that that isnt good enough either.

Which Camera would you think I should Rent.

I just got a new job, and am planning on buyin a D300 in the next few months, but do not know if that will be before the wedding in June or not....

Any suggestions on cameras, while sticking with Nikon? I want to be able to use the same lens that I have for the D40X if all possible

Camera for weddings?

D300 minimum.

D300 / D700 / D3 in order of good better best. Honestly, you don't have quality glass.. So I would get the minimum D300, and some good glass. 2.8 or faster.
Don't rent a wide angel for a wedding.

I'm still saying pass on this.

Scott_Quier · February 5, 2010

98olds wrote:

i will look into rental feels... I am at least looking at renting a Flash, and possible a Wide Angle lens

Renting is a good idea to flesh out your equipment list without taking out a second mortgage to cover it. As for wide - on a cropper, 17mm is about as wide as you need to get for most things. Anything wider is a "special effect" with limited applicability - good for a bit of spice, but "there is such a thing as too much of a good thing."

98olds wrote:

I plan on sticking with Nikon, I have access to using a Nikon D60, but I have a feeling you all will tell me that that isnt good enough either.

Nobody with a brain in their head is going to council you against using Nikon (unless they are joking). Some of my best friends, against my better judgement

, shoot with Nikon and I still associate with them. What is much more important than camera brand is have a tool in your hands that you know and that you know will be able to provide the performance you will need when things get a bit difficult. Will the D60 perform in the clinch? Others will have a better idea of this than will I.

98olds wrote:

Which Camera would you think I should Rent.

I just got a new job, and am planning on buyin a D300 in the next few months, but do not know if that will be before the wedding in June or not....

Any suggestions on cameras, while sticking with Nikon? I want to be able to use the same lens that I have for the D40X if all possible

I'm not a Nikonian and I would not even be able to start to suggest which body(ies) would be able to use your current lens kit. And, as you imply, it's important that the bodies you use all be able to effectively use the same set of lenses.

The Mack · February 5, 2010

Scott_Quier wrote:

Renting is a good idea to flesh out your equipment list without taking out a second mortgage to cover it. As for wide - on a cropper, 17mm is about as wide as you need to get for most things. Anything wider is a "special effect" with limited applicability - good for a bit of spice, but "there is such a thing as too much of a good thing."Nobody with a brain in their head is going to council you against using Nikon (unless they are joking). Some of my best friends, against my better judgement , shoot with Nikon and I still associate with them. What is much more important than camera brand is have a tool in your hands that you know and that you know will be able to provide the performance you will need when things get a bit difficult. Will the D60 perform in the clinch? Others will have a better idea of this than will I.
I'm not a Nikonian and I would not even be able to start to suggest which body(ies) would be able to use your current lens kit. And, as you imply, it's important that the bodies you use all be able to effectively use the same set of lenses.

D60 is simply a newer version of a D40/x.
It's on the same level, and not the wedding level.

Moogle Pepper · February 5, 2010

The Mack wrote:

Camera for weddings?

D300 minimum.

D300 / D700 / D3 in order of good better best. Honestly, you don't have quality glass.. So I would get the minimum D300, and some good glass. 2.8 or faster.
Don't rent a wide angle* for a wedding.

I'm still saying pass on this.

I used a 16-35 mk II to shoot a wedding along with my 50mm. And loved it. I hardly ever took out my 24-70. It's really how you use it and think what can it do for how you want to cover the wedding.

bmoreshooter · February 5, 2010

If your planning on buying a D300 why not rent one and try it out first? If you plan on doing a lot of low light shooting then I would recommend at least the D700. It's far more superior at high ISO ratings. As far as lenses are concerned I would suggest a 24-70 2.8. You will be able to shoot the entire wedding with this lens without any problems. Also have a good flash and plenty of batteries. Battery pack recommended. Keep it simple. Shoot with one camera, one flash and one lens, but have back up when needed. The less you have to worry about equipment, the more you can concentrate on the job at hand. Whatever you select make sure you take adequate time to practice with it and learn it's funtions. I remember when I bought my D700 and was out shooting at a motorcyle race and somehow the camera jumped to auto bracketing and I didn't know how to stop it. Theres no time for bracketing at a race. I did manage to figure it out and only missed one lap, but it could have been a disaster. Prctice, Practice and Practice some more.

I'm shooting a Wedding Advice please

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