Pull backs....lets have some!

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  • travischancetravischance Registered Users Posts: 642 Major grins
    edited January 20, 2012
    As promised, below are a few from my very first ever shoot. The lovely couple are dear friends of mine who asked me to take a few images to use for Christmas cards. They chose #11 which was one of my favorites as well. Looking back, I now realize that I didn't follow Charles' directions of the main light placement (very few catchlights in their eyes). Two 580EX II's triggered with PW Flex TT5's supplied the light. Since it was my first time, I chose ETTL over manual. ne_nau.gif What I noticed was how inconsistent the light was using ETTL (one would be underexposed while the next was overexposed). Please provide C&C - any suggestions on managing reflections in sunglasses would also be beneficial. Thanks!!!

    #1 580EX II through Aurora Firefly 26' Octabox as main & bare 580EX II as fill
    i-nn3RMjr-L.jpg

    #2 Final
    i-NJShfsB-L.jpg

    #3 Final (using sun as hair light)
    i-vJ98gmC-L.jpg

    #4 580EX II through Aurora Firefly 26' Octabox as main & bare 580EX II as fill
    i-pZQzp9q-L.jpg

    #5 Final
    i-4KfrSVc-L.jpg

    #6 Final I know the "mystery hand" is an issue here
    i-3Cvhfkz-L.jpg

    #7 580EX II through Aurora Firefly 26' Octabox as main & bare 580EX II as fill
    i-7QF4g4m-L.jpg

    #8 Final
    i-b9V6t9r-L.jpg

    #9 Final
    i-zHQNcFC-L.jpg

    #10 580EX II through Aurora octabox (camera right) as main & 580EX II bare (camera left & slightly behind Mark) as fill
    i-j2qNwqR-L.jpg

    #11 580EX II fired through umbrella camera left, 74" reflector camera right for fill & 580EX II on couch behind to separate from wall
    i-jWJsNTL-L.jpg
    Travis M. Chance
    twin Mark IV's & a bunch of "L" glass
    sitefacebook
  • HackboneHackbone Registered Users Posts: 4,027 Major grins
    edited January 21, 2012
    Travis, very nice first attempt. Do you feel you were looking at all the details? There is an awful lot to consider isn't there? I like your posing in 5 - 10 & 11. Good job. Always try to keep the male dominant in height if that is the true height. With her sitting on his lap to me her head height seems awkard. Also try to tip the heads toward each other and then also try to keep the noses on the same plane, not one forward and the other back. Could cause focusing issues at times. You have the start of some great posing and very lovely expressions, big congrats to you on that.

    Next time outside try to underexpose the sky to darken it up. If meter says f 11 then shoot at maybe 16 and expose with your flashes for f 16. You can then bring up the blues easier in PP.
  • HackboneHackbone Registered Users Posts: 4,027 Major grins
    edited January 21, 2012
    Travis, give me your thoughts on why shooting in ettl were some shots so inconsistent?
  • travischancetravischance Registered Users Posts: 642 Major grins
    edited January 21, 2012
    Hackbone wrote: »
    Travis, very nice first attempt. Do you feel you were looking at all the details? There is an awful lot to consider isn't there? I like your posing in 5 - 10 & 11. Good job. Always try to keep the male dominant in height if that is the true height. With her sitting on his lap to me her head height seems awkard. Also try to tip the heads toward each other and then also try to keep the noses on the same plane, not one forward and the other back. Could cause focusing issues at times. You have the start of some great posing and very lovely expressions, big congrats to you on that.

    Next time outside try to underexpose the sky to darken it up. If meter says f 11 then shoot at maybe 16 and expose with your flashes for f 16. You can then bring up the blues easier in PP.

    Great feedback Charles. Mark is actually about 6'3" & Lijy is about 5'7". In some of these, I actually had Mark bend a little so that I could both their faces close. I'll remember to keep both noses on the same plane so that both can be in focus (have a few images that I missed). Unfortunately, I shot in Aperture Priority for these thus the reason why I think the ETTL was off (consider #5 & 6). The exposures are different. #5 was shot at f6.3 @ 1/160 ISO 250 while #6 was shot at f6.3 @ 1/100 ISO 250. They are in the same location (I moved to my left while Lijy moved her head the opposite side).
    Travis M. Chance
    twin Mark IV's & a bunch of "L" glass
    sitefacebook
  • HackboneHackbone Registered Users Posts: 4,027 Major grins
    edited January 21, 2012
    Exposures are also different due to the fact the sensor might not be looking in the same place twice. One time it might be catching more of the light sweater so it says whoa back off the light while the second time it might be hitting the darker sweater and saying man, I need more light. Etc with trees coming in, more or less sky etc.

    Again for your first attempt you did one heck of a fine job.
  • travischancetravischance Registered Users Posts: 642 Major grins
    edited January 21, 2012
    Thanks Charles. I'll post more soon (I have several shoots planned)!!!
    Travis M. Chance
    twin Mark IV's & a bunch of "L" glass
    sitefacebook
  • divamumdivamum Registered Users Posts: 9,021 Major grins
    edited January 22, 2012
    Travis, you did a GREAT job on these! #11 in particularly is fantastic - it just glows (in a good way :).

    IME with Canon, Av+ettl leads to some very odd exposures - I always shoot manual when using the flash, at which point ETTL has been generally very reliable for me. On the rare occasion I need automatic exposure for some reason, I've had better luck with the Program mode + flash (vs Av + flash). Ymmv....
  • angevin1angevin1 Registered Users Posts: 3,403 Major grins
    edited January 22, 2012
    Great work TRAVIS! Handsome couple too!
    tom wise
  • 3smiles3smiles Registered Users Posts: 35 Big grins
    edited January 24, 2012
    Wow Love the help on the is thread!
    Liza
  • travischancetravischance Registered Users Posts: 642 Major grins
    edited January 24, 2012
    divamum wrote: »
    Travis, you did a GREAT job on these! #11 in particularly is fantastic - it just glows (in a good way :).
    IME with Canon, Av+ettl leads to some very odd exposures - I always shoot manual when using the flash, at which point ETTL has been generally very reliable for me. On the rare occasion I need automatic exposure for some reason, I've had better luck with the Program mode + flash (vs Av + flash). Ymmv....
    angevin1 wrote: »
    Great work TRAVIS! Handsome couple too!

    Thanks Divamum & Tom!!!
    Travis M. Chance
    twin Mark IV's & a bunch of "L" glass
    sitefacebook
  • SimpsonBrothersSimpsonBrothers Registered Users Posts: 1,079 Major grins
    edited January 27, 2012
    3000PlayTheGuitar-XL.jpg

    407546_2299233420342_1834374045_1472875_1249698959_n.jpg

    Canon 40D
    Nifty 50 at f8
    580EXii on 6' Pearstone ettl cord with construction paper snoot
    550EX slave with construciton paper snoot
    and a subject that swayed... a lot! :D
  • travischancetravischance Registered Users Posts: 642 Major grins
    edited January 27, 2012
    The lighting is awesome on this image - well done ! :D
    Travis M. Chance
    twin Mark IV's & a bunch of "L" glass
    sitefacebook
  • HackboneHackbone Registered Users Posts: 4,027 Major grins
    edited January 27, 2012
    Love the shot and especially the snoots. Your model has wayyyyy to much energy.
  • RyanSRyanS Registered Users Posts: 507 Major grins
    edited January 27, 2012
    Simpson, did you notice the boy in his underwear in the BTS shot? If it doesn't bug you, doesn't bug me. It would bug me, though, if I posted one of my kids in their underwear by accident and someone didn't say something.

    Charles, I've got the interfit reflector panel in the b&h shopping cart. If you could do it again, would you purchase the kit? I'm hoping it is easy to tear down and take with me to do some environmental portraiture indoors.
    Please feel free to post any reworks you do of my images. Crop, skew, munge, edit, share.
    Website | Galleries | Utah PJs
  • SimpsonBrothersSimpsonBrothers Registered Users Posts: 1,079 Major grins
    edited January 28, 2012
    RyanS wrote: »
    Simpson, did you notice the boy in his underwear in the BTS shot? If it doesn't bug you, doesn't bug me. It would bug me, though, if I posted one of my kids in their underwear by accident and someone didn't say something.
    Yep, don't really care.thumb.gif
  • HackboneHackbone Registered Users Posts: 4,027 Major grins
    edited January 28, 2012
    Ryan, which kit are you refering to? They've got a bunch.
  • RyanSRyanS Registered Users Posts: 507 Major grins
    edited January 28, 2012
    Hackbone wrote: »
    Ryan, which kit are you refering to? They've got a bunch.

    http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/331721-REG/Interfit_INT269_Flat_Panel_Reflector_with.html

    The other option is this guy:

    http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/569962-REG/Interfit_INT305_Flexi_Lite_5_in_1_Panel_Kit.html

    That one may be a little too large, though, for most indoor work. Who knows, maybe I should get both and see which one works best in the "real world." I'm mostly interested what you think of the overall quality of the brand. Would you buy it again?
    Please feel free to post any reworks you do of my images. Crop, skew, munge, edit, share.
    Website | Galleries | Utah PJs
  • HackboneHackbone Registered Users Posts: 4,027 Major grins
    edited January 28, 2012
    The first one is extremely close to what I use. I only use the silver side and would not be without it. That's my choice but you know everyones got one.
  • travischancetravischance Registered Users Posts: 642 Major grins
    edited January 28, 2012
    RyanS wrote: »
    http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/331721-REG/Interfit_INT269_Flat_Panel_Reflector_with.html

    The other option is this guy:

    http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/569962-REG/Interfit_INT305_Flexi_Lite_5_in_1_Panel_Kit.html

    That one may be a little too large, though, for most indoor work. Who knows, maybe I should get both and see which one works best in the "real world." I'm mostly interested what you think of the overall quality of the brand. Would you buy it again?

    I looked at these just before Christmas & the Calumet frame & panel. In the end, I settled on the Photoflex LiteDisc reflector. The prices have gone up since I purchased mine. I like it thus far!
    Travis M. Chance
    twin Mark IV's & a bunch of "L" glass
    sitefacebook
  • travischancetravischance Registered Users Posts: 642 Major grins
    edited January 28, 2012
    A few from today with the kids (Kellan wasn't very interested)!!!

    3 light setup:
    1 Calumet Genesis 400 through Creative Light 3' Octabox
    2 Canon 580EX II's (1 through an umbrella & 1 bare)

    All were shot in Manual (both camera & strobes). I know that shutter speed controls the ambient, but how do I manage over exposing the image with lower shutter speeds? And yes I understand that the larger & closer the source, the softer. In the pull backs below, you'll notice that one of the speedlites is serving as the main. This was not by design....our living room (camera right) is all windows & when the Genesis was placed there, the natural light wouldn't allow the built in photo cell to trigger the monolight. Thus the reason why it's on the dark side of the room (camera left). At some point, I'm going to purchase a trigger to eliminate this issue (any suggestions). Thanks for looking & please offer suggestions - Thanks :D

    #1
    580EX II as main light (1/2 power) & Genesis as fill (power level 12)
    i-23kH9Xm-L.jpg

    #2
    580EX II as main light (1/2 power) & Genesis as fill (power level 12)
    i-wRskQpW-L.jpg

    #3
    580EX II as main light (1/2 power) & Genesis as fill (power level 12)
    i-8zfZj22-L.jpg

    #4
    i-KwFm5v2-L.jpg

    #5
    580EX II as main light (1/8 power), Genesis as fill (power level 10) & 580EX II as rim (1/16 power)
    i-NnM7ZPW-L.jpg

    #6
    580EX II as main light (1/8 power), Genesis as fill (power level 10) & 580EX II as rim (1/16 power)
    i-2vBGjHQ-L.jpg

    #7
    580EX II as main light (1/8 power), Genesis as fill (power level 10) & 580EX II as rim (1/16power)
    i-Bvkd2sP-L.jpg
    Travis M. Chance
    twin Mark IV's & a bunch of "L" glass
    sitefacebook
  • travischancetravischance Registered Users Posts: 642 Major grins
    edited January 28, 2012
    Anyone use beauty dishes instead of umbrellas? I have 2 white tranlucent umbrellas and 1 silver. I hear that BD's provide great light and don't seem to be as cumbersome as umbrellas. Thoughts & suggestions?
    Travis M. Chance
    twin Mark IV's & a bunch of "L" glass
    sitefacebook
  • HackboneHackbone Registered Users Posts: 4,027 Major grins
    edited January 28, 2012
    Ryan, remember the 80/20 rule? It states you will use 20% of your stuff 80% of the time. Think about you wardrobe.....isn't it true. It also goes for most things in life, especially camera gear. A white foam core board makes a great reflector also.

    Travis, nice work but doesn't every photo seem to be lit evenly? I think this is great for catalog work ( you hit the nail on the head there ) but in portrature you should show depth. Again to the rules and they can be broken but the fill light should be on the same side as the main but closer to the center axsis. The red flowers seem to be getting ready to grab the children.

    Not sure what you mean about the ambient and shutter speed.

    Could you have used the window light and the power light as fill for the dark side?

    In my work with beauty dishes I find you have to have the correct model with a thin face. The light needs to be hitting them dead on and just above the lens and you get great light but if you have a full face in makes it broader and no model likes that. It also is a harsher light and does not wrap around as well.
  • HinsonHinson Registered Users Posts: 219 Major grins
    edited January 28, 2012
    A few from today with the kids (Kellan wasn't very interested)!!!

    3 light setup:
    1 Calumet Genesis 400 through Creative Light 3' Octabox
    2 Canon 580EX II's (1 through an umbrella & 1 bare)

    All were shot in Manual (both camera & strobes). I know that shutter speed controls the ambient, but how do I manage over exposing the image with lower shutter speeds? And yes I understand that the larger & closer the source, the softer. In the pull backs below, you'll notice that one of the speedlites is serving as the main. This was not by design....our living room (camera right) is all windows & when the Genesis was placed there, the natural light wouldn't allow the built in photo cell to trigger the monolight. Thus the reason why it's on the dark side of the room (camera left). At some point, I'm going to purchase a trigger to eliminate this issue (any suggestions). Thanks for looking & please offer suggestions - Thanks :D

    580EX II as main light (1/8 power), Genesis as fill (power level 10) & 580EX II as rim (1/16power)

    Travis; I'm probably wrong but in the first image, it appears that the umbrella and flash are backwards to the bracket. In other words put the umbrella in from the other side and turn the flash around.
    Serving Him by Serving Others
    www.Jerrywhitephotography.com
  • HackboneHackbone Registered Users Posts: 4,027 Major grins
    edited January 28, 2012
    Hinson, I think he is using it as a shoot thru for a softer light effect.
  • travischancetravischance Registered Users Posts: 642 Major grins
    edited January 28, 2012
    Hinson wrote: »
    Travis; I'm probably wrong but in the first image, it appears that the umbrella and flash are backwards to the bracket. In other words put the umbrella in from the other side and turn the flash around.

    You're right - it can be used backwards. For this shot, I was using it as a shoot through to soften the light.
    Travis M. Chance
    twin Mark IV's & a bunch of "L" glass
    sitefacebook
  • travischancetravischance Registered Users Posts: 642 Major grins
    edited January 28, 2012
    Hackbone wrote: »
    Ryan, remember the 80/20 rule? It states you will use 20% of your stuff 80% of the time. Think about you wardrobe.....isn't it true. It also goes for most things in life, especially camera gear. A white foam core board makes a great reflector also.

    Travis, nice work but doesn't every photo seem to be lit evenly? I think this is great for catalog work ( you hit the nail on the head there ) but in portrature you should show depth. Again to the rules and they can be broken but the fill light should be on the same side as the main but closer to the center axsis. The red flowers seem to be getting ready to grab the children.

    Not sure what you mean about the ambient and shutter speed.

    Could you have used the window light and the power light as fill for the dark side?

    In my work with beauty dishes I find you have to have the correct model with a thin face. The light needs to be hitting them dead on and just above the lens and you get great light but if you have a full face in makes it broader and no model likes that. It also is a harsher light and does not wrap around as well.

    Good points & you're right, there isn't much depth as there simply isn't much shadow. Re the ambient shutter speed, doesn't the shutter speed control the amount of "available" light? I guess I could stop the lens down 1 or 2 stops & adjust the shutter speed the same amount. If you notice, a few have great light on the subject(s), but the background is underexposed. I'm wondering how to have the background lit well in addition to the subjects.

    This is definitely a learning curve. I'll give this a go again tomorrow & make some adjustments. Thanks again Charles!
    Travis M. Chance
    twin Mark IV's & a bunch of "L" glass
    sitefacebook
  • HackboneHackbone Registered Users Posts: 4,027 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    Travis, shutter does control ambient light but you've got flash bouncing all over the room that is probably overpowering any ambient light that is there.

    To light the bkg area as you want your subject lit means you've got to hit it with an equal amt of light on both bkg and subject.

    On the ones where you've got "great light on the subject but the bkg is underexposed" remember as light travels there is light fall off so the bkg will go darker.

    Hope that helps.
  • 0scar990scar99 Registered Users Posts: 71 Big grins
    edited January 31, 2012
    I think having your background a little darker can be fine as it creates seperation for your subject. How much is a matter of taste/ style
  • SimpsonBrothersSimpsonBrothers Registered Users Posts: 1,079 Major grins
    edited January 31, 2012
    Hinson wrote: »
    Travis; I'm probably wrong but in the first image, it appears that the umbrella and flash are backwards to the bracket. In other words put the umbrella in from the other side and turn the flash around.
    Hackbone wrote: »
    Hinson, I think he is using it as a shoot thru for a softer light effect.
    What Hinson was trying to say is that the umbrella is mounted incorrectly. Put it in from the other side of the holder and it will tilt the umbrella up so that the flash fires in to the center of the umbrella instead of the top half. (still shoot through) :D Generally on the mount one side of the hole will be higher than the other.
  • HinsonHinson Registered Users Posts: 219 Major grins
    edited January 31, 2012
    What Hinson was trying to say is that the umbrella is mounted incorrectly. Put it in from the other side of the holder and it will tilt the umbrella up so that the flash fires in to the center of the umbrella instead of the top half. (still shoot through) :D Generally on the mount one side of the hole will be higher than the other.

    Exactly. Thanks for making that clear.
    Serving Him by Serving Others
    www.Jerrywhitephotography.com
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