Good work SmugMug team...Fast loading images.
I noticed when I made a photo comment the pageNav in the comment header showed multiple pages although there was only one comment.
I made a gallery comment and the pageNav went to the correct page count.
Hmmm, DJ raises an interesting point that has me worrying a bit now. First of all, let me repeat what I said in a previous post--I love the flyouts and I love that with them, the area beneath the photo has been cleaned up. I want this to work.
But, DJ's comment made me think about this fact: When I ask people viewing my site if they bother to rate photos with the thumbs, people who do not have their own smugmug site (and even some that do) always ask me, "What thumbs?" My viewers simply never mouseover the main pick to see the thumb flyout. So, now I'm worried they won't find the new flyout and, therefore, will believe these options aren't available.
This probably isn't as big of a deal as it seems to me at the moment. I'm just wondering if there has been some thought given as to how to "encourage" people to mouseover? Perhaps this is something else resolved in Phase 2.
This has been bugging me for some time. We've been under a lot of pressure to do flyouts for awhile because our customers have seen them on sites targeted exclusively to serious amateurs. And everyone who sees them loves them because they are so beautiful and keep the page so clean.
I'm getting pretty comfortable with them because most of the consumer behavior we see is they go for the biggest images and click them, even on our home page, just to see what happens.
When we ship this you can bet we'll be watching that like a hawk. One thing we're sure of, though: once they get it they really love it.
One thing we're sure of, though: once they get it they really love it.
Having some more time to browse through peoples' beta pages has made me realize one thing I do miss now. I would still like to see the camera used below the photo.
(In fact, I would like to see the camera and lens, but that would be a feature request on top of the current layout as well. I've always really liked the brief EXIF data Pbase puts below images. It would be sweet if we could add variables in captions for this. OK, sorry, way off topic now...)
Don't know whether it's possible, but here's another nitpick...
Currently, when arrowing from the last image on a page to the first on the next page (i.e. from #15 to #16), the thumbs for the new page appear before the main image. If I'm speed-arrowing through a gallery, I'd like the main image to pop in first and the thumbs follow behind.
Having some more time to browse through peoples' beta pages has made me realize one thing I do miss now. I would still like to see the camera used below the photo.
(In fact, I would like to see the camera and lens, but that would be a feature request on top of the current layout as well. I've always really liked the brief EXIF data Pbase puts below images. It would be sweet if we could add variables in captions for this. OK, sorry, way off topic now...)
Does the persistent exif window not solve this problem well enough for you?
I think the problem here is that while quite a few visitors to a gallery do care about the camera information, there are also a lot that don't. So having an exif window that persists allows the ones that do care to see it while not cluttering up the page for the other visitors.
That's just my opinion though. Anyone else have thoughts on the matter?
Does the persistent exif window not solve this problem well enough for you?
I think the problem here is that while quite a few visitors to a gallery do care about the camera information, there are also a lot that don't. So having an exif window that persists allows the ones that do care to see it while not cluttering up the page for the other visitors.
That's just my opinion though. Anyone else have thoughts on the matter?
I didn't realize until your post that the EXIF window was persistent. That's pretty sweet!
Well that presents another issue then that we will have to discuss. Perhaps it isn't obvious enough that it persists.
I think it's obvious enough with the close "x". I mean, you might miss it, but if you made it more obvious I'm not sure that would help the overall user experience, either. As with any interface, I don't think that all people will "get" all functions at all times. I miss stuff all the time, not because it's a design flaw, but because I've got wax in my ears, or I looked the other way, or...
I've noticed that if I leave my beta page open in a tab for a long time without looking at it, and then I click on the tab that the entire page is reloaded just by virtue of the fact that I clicked on the tab. Lee will blame Safari, but what's the real reason?
Actually, I don't really care why it happens, since I won't understand the answer, anyway! Just wanted to report it.
That's just my opinion though. Anyone else have thoughts on the matter?
I too miss having the camera info there all the time - and the option (if made available) to see the exif. But again this goes back to one of my points - if someone doesn't place the mouse over the larger image, we won't know its accessable.
What about a little 'flap' on the edge of a photo - this would grab the vieweres attention that there is something there for us to see - and we will move our pointer to the area, bringing the flyout. Eh? Eh?
I've noticed that if I leave my beta page open in a tab for a long time without looking at it, and then I click on the tab that the entire page is reloaded just by virtue of the fact that I clicked on the tab. Lee will blame Safari, but what's the real reason?
Actually, I don't really care why it happens, since I won't understand the answer, anyway! Just wanted to report it.
Does the persistent exif window not solve this problem well enough for you?
I think the problem here is that while quite a few visitors to a gallery do care about the camera information, there are also a lot that don't. So having an exif window that persists allows the ones that do care to see it while not cluttering up the page for the other visitors.
I also had not picked up on the EXIF window persistence. That is so suweeet!
Does it solve the problem for me? Well, it goes a very long way. Truth be told, I would still prefer the option of having a brief display below the pic. But, I understand many, many people could care less about this. So, I'll have to concede that the persistent window is a very good compromise.
I just have to say again that all of this really rocks! I'm sure there are still other little features I haven't even stumbled upon yet.
Long enough that I lost track of it. Long enough that the images might not have been in the cache anymore? I really dunno. Wish I could be more help. I do think that what triggered the reload wasn't clicking on the tab but hovering, but I'm not sure about that. It happened more than once, though. I'll try to pay more attention to it.
I also had not picked up on the EXIF window persistence. That is so suweeet!
For those of you who didn't pick up on it, may I ask why not? Were you closing the window each time before clicking on another photo? Or had you just not browsed through galleries enough to pick up on it yet? Or something else?
What about a little 'flap' on the edge of a photo - this would grab the vieweres attention that there is something there for us to see - and we will move our pointer to the area, bringing the flyout. Eh? Eh?
Sounds like it's worth a try to me.... But, I can see how that might be difficult to do without adding a little clutter.
Just to look at this issue from the glass half full perspective... earlier I pointed out how people never rated my picks because they never saw the thumbs flyover. Well, the more attention drawn to flyovers in general, the better the odds people will see and click the thumbs.
K, it just did it again. It was 6 minutes or more (timed from my last post on the topic to a minute ago). And all it took was clicking on the tab, and the page reloaded.
For those of you who didn't pick up on it, may I ask why not? Were you closing the window each time before clicking on another photo? Or had you just not browsed through galleries enough to pick up on it yet? Or something else?
I was closing the window each time, but I'm not sure why. I think it was because I wanted to see the image beneath it, again, after viewing the EXIF. And, I didn't realize it was dragable to get it out of the way. I naturally assumed it was constrained by the image itself. I won't make that mistake again.
The "problem" I think you're running into is this: Many of us are still very used to the constraints of Web 1.0. They are now ingrained in our intuition about how the internet works. So, as you add these cutting edge features, it's going to take some time for people to think outside the box (quite literally). Despite my earlier posts, the more I think about it, I'm not sure you should expend too much effort leading people to some of these features. I think it's really a matter of education and time. Eventually, we'll all just expect things to work like fancy, dragable, persistent windows.
A good analogy is right-click context menus in Windows. Back in they day, they didn't exist. I don't know how long they existed before I even started using them. But now, if I can't find a feature or option on the screen, I right click it just expecting I'll be presented with a context-sensitive menu. As natural as that is to me now, Windows never "directed" me to find them. Had it, there would have been one more thing cluttering my screen.
But, DJ's comment made me think about this fact: When I ask people viewing my site if they bother to rate photos with the thumbs, people who do not have their own smugmug site (and even some that do) always ask me, "What thumbs?" My viewers simply never mouseover the main pick to see the thumb flyout. So, now I'm worried they won't find the new flyout and, therefore, will believe these options aren't available.
I don't know the technical feasability of these or if there is screen space available but I thought some of the following might solve this problem:
1) a note saying "hover your mouse over the large image for more options"
2) or perhaps a brief appearance of that message on the large window the first time someone visits (set by cookie -- but not sure how this would behave for folks w cookies turned off; or have an option to never see that flyout again for a given user)
3) I think someone else mentioned this (but can't find it) some sort of a "tab" on the window that invites clicking which would expand the flyaway
Don't know whether it's possible, but here's another nitpick...
Currently, when arrowing from the last image on a page to the first on the next page (i.e. from #15 to #16), the thumbs for the new page appear before the main image. If I'm speed-arrowing through a gallery, I'd like the main image to pop in first and the thumbs follow behind.
The main image is requested first, then the thumbnails. The thumbs are so small, though, that they often arrive first and get drawn first.
The main image is drawn as soon we have the bytes.
Clean = Great! I love not having all that stuff underneath the pictures.
When I view the exif the last line of info is on the bottom of the exif frame. (see attachment). Not really a huge deal at all...just something I noticed.
In general, I like it! I'm not really in great shape to go into too much detail right now, but I'll try to do so later.
When I view the exif the last line of info is on the bottom of the exif frame. (see attachment). Not really a huge deal at all...just something I noticed.
I noticed (just now - had to go to work for a couple hours), that if you open the exif window, positition it somewhere, and close it - the next time you open it - it's in the position you left it kinda nice.
Some bugs and observations
In FF 2.0, i find that the "persistent" exif box is not so persistent. When I open an image in the lightbox, the exif box disappears when the LB is closed.
Also, i like all these slick looking things, however, they do something that i despise on photo sites. They all cover the image. I didnt like it with the thumbs, and they were just kinda tiny, but these things are huge. I find that I have to move the exif thing every time. Also, sometimes it seems to randomly move by a few pixels, havnt been able to sort out why.
Would it be possible to have the pop out thingies slide out to the side or something? or the bottom where there may be more room? then they could even always be there, and look just as slick and "web 2.0"
Comments
I noticed when I made a photo comment the pageNav in the comment header showed multiple pages although there was only one comment.
I made a gallery comment and the pageNav went to the correct page count.
Beta is looking good....
Beta Site
I'm getting pretty comfortable with them because most of the consumer behavior we see is they go for the biggest images and click them, even on our home page, just to see what happens.
When we ship this you can bet we'll be watching that like a hawk. One thing we're sure of, though: once they get it they really love it.
Having some more time to browse through peoples' beta pages has made me realize one thing I do miss now. I would still like to see the camera used below the photo.
(In fact, I would like to see the camera and lens, but that would be a feature request on top of the current layout as well. I've always really liked the brief EXIF data Pbase puts below images. It would be sweet if we could add variables in captions for this. OK, sorry, way off topic now...)
www.ackersphotography.com
I see that it will (finally!) be able to have the "see photo in gallery" text when doing a keyword search on multiply keywords.
However, the quick links to combine with related keywords has now vanished...
Currently, when arrowing from the last image on a page to the first on the next page (i.e. from #15 to #16), the thumbs for the new page appear before the main image. If I'm speed-arrowing through a gallery, I'd like the main image to pop in first and the thumbs follow behind.
Swim for Them | WellmanHouse.net | AlbumFetcher | SmugShowBuilder
Does the persistent exif window not solve this problem well enough for you?
I think the problem here is that while quite a few visitors to a gallery do care about the camera information, there are also a lot that don't. So having an exif window that persists allows the ones that do care to see it while not cluttering up the page for the other visitors.
That's just my opinion though. Anyone else have thoughts on the matter?
I didn't realize until your post that the EXIF window was persistent. That's pretty sweet!
Swim for Them | WellmanHouse.net | AlbumFetcher | SmugShowBuilder
Well that presents another issue then that we will have to discuss. Perhaps it isn't obvious enough that it persists.
I think it's obvious enough with the close "x". I mean, you might miss it, but if you made it more obvious I'm not sure that would help the overall user experience, either. As with any interface, I don't think that all people will "get" all functions at all times. I miss stuff all the time, not because it's a design flaw, but because I've got wax in my ears, or I looked the other way, or...
Dgrin FAQ | Me | Workshops
Actually, I don't really care why it happens, since I won't understand the answer, anyway! Just wanted to report it.
Dgrin FAQ | Me | Workshops
I too miss having the camera info there all the time - and the option (if made available) to see the exif. But again this goes back to one of my points - if someone doesn't place the mouse over the larger image, we won't know its accessable.
What about a little 'flap' on the edge of a photo - this would grab the vieweres attention that there is something there for us to see - and we will move our pointer to the area, bringing the flyout. Eh? Eh?
Derek
What did Cinderella say when she left the photo shop? "One day my prints will come."
Does it solve the problem for me? Well, it goes a very long way. Truth be told, I would still prefer the option of having a brief display below the pic. But, I understand many, many people could care less about this. So, I'll have to concede that the persistent window is a very good compromise.
I just have to say again that all of this really rocks! I'm sure there are still other little features I haven't even stumbled upon yet.
www.ackersphotography.com
Long enough that I lost track of it. Long enough that the images might not have been in the cache anymore? I really dunno. Wish I could be more help. I do think that what triggered the reload wasn't clicking on the tab but hovering, but I'm not sure about that. It happened more than once, though. I'll try to pay more attention to it.
Dgrin FAQ | Me | Workshops
For those of you who didn't pick up on it, may I ask why not? Were you closing the window each time before clicking on another photo? Or had you just not browsed through galleries enough to pick up on it yet? Or something else?
It's really just a persistent drag...
Dgrin FAQ | Me | Workshops
Sounds like it's worth a try to me.... But, I can see how that might be difficult to do without adding a little clutter.
Just to look at this issue from the glass half full perspective... earlier I pointed out how people never rated my picks because they never saw the thumbs flyover. Well, the more attention drawn to flyovers in general, the better the odds people will see and click the thumbs.
www.ackersphotography.com
K, it just did it again. It was 6 minutes or more (timed from my last post on the topic to a minute ago). And all it took was clicking on the tab, and the page reloaded.
EDIT: Fully updated OSX 10.4.
Dgrin FAQ | Me | Workshops
The "problem" I think you're running into is this: Many of us are still very used to the constraints of Web 1.0. They are now ingrained in our intuition about how the internet works. So, as you add these cutting edge features, it's going to take some time for people to think outside the box (quite literally). Despite my earlier posts, the more I think about it, I'm not sure you should expend too much effort leading people to some of these features. I think it's really a matter of education and time. Eventually, we'll all just expect things to work like fancy, dragable, persistent windows.
A good analogy is right-click context menus in Windows. Back in they day, they didn't exist. I don't know how long they existed before I even started using them. But now, if I can't find a feature or option on the screen, I right click it just expecting I'll be presented with a context-sensitive menu. As natural as that is to me now, Windows never "directed" me to find them. Had it, there would have been one more thing cluttering my screen.
www.ackersphotography.com
I don't know the technical feasability of these or if there is screen space available but I thought some of the following might solve this problem:
1) a note saying "hover your mouse over the large image for more options"
2) or perhaps a brief appearance of that message on the large window the first time someone visits (set by cookie -- but not sure how this would behave for folks w cookies turned off; or have an option to never see that flyout again for a given user)
3) I think someone else mentioned this (but can't find it) some sort of a "tab" on the window that invites clicking which would expand the flyaway
http://mkress65.zenfolio.com
http://mkress65.smugmug.com
The main image is requested first, then the thumbnails. The thumbs are so small, though, that they often arrive first and get drawn first.
The main image is drawn as soon we have the bytes.
But I'll think about this some.
Don
http://beta.smugmug.net/keyword/all/lotsofphotos#2451
Check the pagepicker...
Portfolio • Workshops • Facebook • Twitter
Clean = Great! I love not having all that stuff underneath the pictures.
When I view the exif the last line of info is on the bottom of the exif frame. (see attachment). Not really a huge deal at all...just something I noticed.
In general, I like it! I'm not really in great shape to go into too much detail right now, but I'll try to do so later.
Gallery of mine...caution, it's under CONSTANT construction! | Photo Journal
In the right light, at the right time, everything is extraordinary. ~Aaron Rose
Yeah thanks - the guys know about this one
Portfolio • Workshops • Facebook • Twitter
Heh well then I guess it's okay that I forgot to put the attachment on!
Told you I was in no shape to give details!
Gallery of mine...caution, it's under CONSTANT construction! | Photo Journal
In the right light, at the right time, everything is extraordinary. ~Aaron Rose
What did Cinderella say when she left the photo shop? "One day my prints will come."
High Desert Racing Photography
975 fps
What did Cinderella say when she left the photo shop? "One day my prints will come."
In FF 2.0, i find that the "persistent" exif box is not so persistent. When I open an image in the lightbox, the exif box disappears when the LB is closed.
Also, i like all these slick looking things, however, they do something that i despise on photo sites. They all cover the image. I didnt like it with the thumbs, and they were just kinda tiny, but these things are huge. I find that I have to move the exif thing every time. Also, sometimes it seems to randomly move by a few pixels, havnt been able to sort out why.
Would it be possible to have the pop out thingies slide out to the side or something? or the bottom where there may be more room? then they could even always be there, and look just as slick and "web 2.0"
-r