Getting antsy....... any cure?
What cure does Smugmug have for Pro users who are getting a little antsy / anxious to get going on the smugstock (or whatever you're going to be naming it?)
Seriously, we all want you to get it right and do not want to sound like I'm rushing you (but can you hurry up ) but, it's been a REALLY really long time since your first announcement on this.
Is there a way to give us a little, tiny, itsy, bitsy hint as to when this is going to come to fusion? Or at the very least, stop leaving us totally in the dark.
Thanks smugmug......
we're getting antsy but, we still love you :-)
Markjay
Canon AE1 - it was my first "real camera"
Canon 20D - no more film!
Is there a way to give us a little, tiny, itsy, bitsy hint as to when this is going to come to fusion? Or at the very least, stop leaving us totally in the dark.
Thanks smugmug......
we're getting antsy but, we still love you :-)
In the dark, hey, I've update you personally in this thread
We'll announce when we're ready, and no sooner, I'm sorry... I wish I had more to say but I don't
You've updated me personally with basically no new information. I wouldn't call that exactly an update but... you DID in fact answer my post. Thank you.
You've updated me personally with basically no new information. I wouldn't call that exactly an update but... you DID in fact answer my post. Thank you.
Have a nice weekend, Andy.
Mark, I didn't take offense, that's why my post had a smilie in it. Cheers!
Another question
I seem to find different ways to ask the same question but, really this time it's different :D
If you could illustrate to us anxious (but patient) pro users, where on a list of 10 priorities the stock photo site is ( 1 being the highest 10 being the lowest priority) given all the "things" smugmug is updating and getting ready to 'roll out", could you elaborate at least on this, Andy (or ?)
I'm not asking for a release date
I'm not asking what it's going to look like or details regarding it.....
just a 'where on the list of 1-10' you've set this?
Thanks a bunch. We New Yorkers are persistant aren't we?
Markjay
Canon AE1 - it was my first "real camera"
Canon 20D - no more film!
just a 'where on the list of 1-10' you've set this?
We can't say anything sensible about that, I'm sorry. Even if we could, it would mean nothing, really, because you wouldn't know where other things that we are working on rank
Standardized Keyword Search?
In prep for the hotly-anticipated feature, I've been designing stock photo processing into my workflow and I need a bit of info from folks familiar with the stock photo market: Specifically, is it worth the hassle to standardize my keyword vocabulary on something like Controlled Vocabulary? Will it in any way improve my chances of being seen by stock buyers? In other words, do stock buyer tend to search on standardized search terms?
In prep for the hotly-anticipated feature, I've been designing stock photo processing into my workflow and I need a bit of info from folks familiar with the stock photo market: Specifically, is it worth the hassle to standardize my keyword vocabulary on something like Controlled Vocabulary? Will it in any way improve my chances of being seen by stock buyers? In other words, do stock buyer tend to search on standardized search terms?
That's an excelent question,
image description, duh... I mean..., man,middle aged,vertical,full body,one person,up angle,front,isolated,
these and similiar terms are what are going to be used to narow down the search after they type in football player.
Yes Yes and Yes
I have beel waiting for a long time for this announcement. Looking forward to your email in my mail box!
The only input I have is:
1. A Class Act
2. Very High Quality Images
3. At least three or four images sizes
4. Image Keyword Placement
Smugmug Rocks!
0
Matthew SavilleRegistered Users, Retired ModPosts: 3,352Major grins
edited April 7, 2008
Alright, everybody. In about one month, it'll have been about a year.
Obviously you're going to remain tight-lipped about DATES, so I'm not going to bother prodding. But is there anywhere that we can go to read up on this, this THING, code-name Smugstock, in general? I can't spend the time to read all 7 pages.
I at least want someone to tell me that, given this long wait, the project is going to WORK, (meaning I can actually count on making sales if my images are decent) and that it will be worth my time to organize my portfolios and set keywords and prices, etc.
Better yet, anyobdy who wants to speak up on HOW to price your stock images, and HOW to keyword them, please do so. And, I think this information needs to be collected on a page somewhere, not a 7-page forum thread that is 90% people asking "when"...
I've left my nature photography on the back burner for over a year now because I couldn't figure out how to earn a living off of it. No matter how good I got at MAKING images, I couldn't find the outlets to effectively SELL them...
I'm already diving into selling Fine Art Textures to other wedding / portrait photographers, and I'm having to resort to Google Adwords to get traffic. Come on, Smugmug, you can do it! Woohoo! clap
Yup. Lotsa moving parts on this, Matthew - I wish I could give you our legal bill :uhoh
Okay see, I dunno about the other forumers here, but "lots of moving parts" is all I need to hear to make me happy. Having been here for almost as long as you have, Andy, I KNOW that Smugmug delivers the goods.
Now, what about assembling a page that can simply sum up what has been said so far, and how we can prepare? Like I said I'm not hungry for dates, I just want to be as ready as I can.
Pricing for example- On some websites you can download high-res images for just a few bucks, on some you can download an almost unlimited amount for just one monthly fee, and then finally on others you have to pay hundreds or thousands for each image.
Personally I can't bring myself to offer a high-res original of my prized nature photos for less than what I'd charge for a 5x7 print, yet nor do I see my images ever pulling hundreds of dollars per licensing sale when they're "lost" in a sea of smugstock where everybody is setting their own prices at whatever they want...
So, what the heck do I do? Just wait for it to debut, and then frantically scope out the other photographer's prices, and set mine so that I'm somewhere in the middle, and just pray for traffic / sales?
Maybe I need to re-read all of Chris' posts in here back towards the beginning to get these answers. But again like I said, a summary page would be nice...
Why such a big bill to enable stock sales? Me thinks the lawyers are milking it.....
Nah, I disagree, David. We're talking contract law, copyright law, potential complaints about credit, model releases, restricted images, and probably stuff I can't imagine. We live in a litigious society, one that likes to argue in Court, where the risks come in big dollars.
SmugMug not only has to provide protection for themselves, but for us (the photographers) as well. And they have to provide some sort of guarantee that EVERY image posted by a S'mugger will be lawful, useable, and original. Without screening every image beforehand, they have to set up a system that holds only the resposible party liable if something DOES go wrong.
Failing to do that would not only jeopardize the Stock Photo idea, but SmugMug in general.
Lawyers tend to milk things, yes... it's in their interest. But good lawyers take their time to be thorough and get it right the first time... and it's a lot less expensive to let them do that than to pay in Court for getting it wrong down the line...
Nah, I disagree, David. We're talking contract law, copyright law, potential complaints about credit, model releases, restricted images, and probably stuff I can't imagine. We live in a litigious society, one that likes to argue in Court, where the risks come in big dollars.
SmugMug not only has to provide protection for themselves, but for us (the photographers) as well. And they have to provide some sort of guarantee that EVERY image posted by a S'mugger will be lawful, useable, and original. Without screening every image beforehand, they have to set up a system that holds only the resposible party liable if something DOES go wrong.
Failing to do that would not only jeopardize the Stock Photo idea, but SmugMug in general.
Lawyers tend to milk things, yes... it's in their interest. But good lawyers take their time to be thorough and get it right the first time... and it's a lot less expensive to let them do that than to pay in Court for getting it wrong down the line...
One of the habits that Smugmug has and I love is that they are into a "satisfaction guaranteed" methodology with their customers. Especially in print sales, Smugmug is extremely generous with their policy, and quick to replace / refund people's orders if they are not satisfied.
I can only imagine the great lengths Smugmug's legal team is having to go to right now to continue a very friendly policy while covering a whole new world of Smugmug liability...
I've left my nature photography on the back burner for over a year now because I couldn't figure out how to earn a living off of it. No matter how good I got at MAKING images, I couldn't find the outlets to effectively SELL them... clap
Take care,
=Matt=
Sorry Matt, But if your idea is to effectively sell them stock wont do it.
Landscapes and other pretty pictures don't preform well as stock.
Sorry Matt, But if your idea is to effectively sell them stock wont do it.
Landscapes and other pretty pictures don't preform well as stock.
Wow, that made it easy for me! Thanks for the tip.
I have pretty much assumed from day one that being a professional nature photographer is dead, unless you're already in it and very well established, or a total prodigy kid with perfect marketing skills to boot. In general people just don't go on the internet randomly to google and buy nature photography prints, nor are they interested in paying the hundreds / thousands that a good nature stock image used to pull for rights-managed OR royalty free licensed use...
Which is why I got into wedding and event photography anyway.
It would be the ultimate career to teach workshops in the high sierras like the Muench's do, but it'll take me decades to get to that point!
Alright, back to work! Got two jobs to deliver today, and two more to shoot! Here's to hoping the REST of you get Smugstock sooner than later... :-\
I think sooner OR later is what you meant, Matt :-)
I'm sure they are taking their sweet time with this, because they want to get it right the first time. I'm cool with that but the wait is in a word.....
excruciating!
While scanning this forum I saw this STOCK PHOTO for sale idea posted and said "Wow that would be a great idea" Then I saw the DATE of MAY 2007 of the original post and it said a FEW WEEKS away, guess they ran into more problems then anticipated with this idea I'm glad I didn't get TOO excited, a year later and still nothing. Too bad, it would make some of us some additional money I'm sure.
New Jersey Photographer Professional Photographers Association & National Photoshop Professionals Member www.billpador.com
I agree it would bea good move for SmugMug to start a stock area as long as the photographers have a choice of Royalty Free and Rights Managed. This will ensure that both SmugMug and the photographers will making money. There are buyers all over the world who are willing to pay a good price for quality photos.
Is this dead in the water ?
It's been more than a year since this was announced but still hasn't happened. :-(
If your back and forth with lawyers for this long-I suggest you get better lawyers! They sure could be running up the tab.Photoshelter Collection got off the ground in a few months....Is this going to be happening or should I just bite the bullet and load our stock with another service that is already established ?
It's been more than a year since this was announced but still hasn't happened. :-(
If your back and forth with lawyers for this long-I suggest you get better lawyers! They sure could be running up the tab.Photoshelter Collection got off the ground in a few months....Is this going to be happening or should I just bite the bullet and load our stock with another service that is already established ?
itsme
If you have stock worthy shots and you're waiting, then you are wasting money.
I started at istock 9-07, with only thiry files uploaded as of now, only 15 of which are getting DL'd with any regularity I broke $800 today. Took my first dissbursement recently and used it to get my wife and I new iPhones. They are sooo cool.
If I was a betting man I'd say stock is not going to happen a SmugMug (I love SmugMug, but it is what it is and it's not a stock site). If Smugmug were to do it, it would have to be a totally different entity, they couldn't just say "come buy stock from our contributers" and stick there name on it.
I am by no means an expert on it, but they can't just tell you to flick a switch in the control panel and you're gallery will be available for stock
If it's Royalty free then there has to be an inspection process for each individual image. They won't be able to have their name on it and assume that you've taken the time to deal with copywrighted or intellectual property issues, and model releases, and they can't put the liability on the contributer because no one would buy with that risk. Then there is the issue of tagging and keywording, if there is no inspection proccess then the searches are rendered worthless. What about plain old quality inspection? is that left to the contributer too? My favorite request in this forum is that everyone want's to set there own price, and the assumption is that microstock equals low quality. 950 DL's = $800 in 8 months on 31files, only 19 of which have been DL'ed at all and only 10 of which with any consistency. So yeah, less than a $1 average, with that there are quite a few iStockers making a living at it.
SmugStock would have to be just that, a totally seperate entity started from scratch, I can't imagine a successfull scenario otherwise.
The bottom line is, if you are interested in getting into stock or even just trying it out, there is no benefit in waiting here. http://istockphoto.com/index.php?refnum=beetle8
If you have stock worthy shots and you're waiting, then you are wasting money...
Keith, check out the previous postings by "Itsme" earlier in this thread. Apparently he is a professional stock photographer and is quite established; has been making a living at this for years...
Hmmm?
Well to quote myself, I'm no expert.
However, one of my points seems to be validated in his research, that no other site will except imbedded data for keywording.
Again I'm no expert
When I was looking for a partner to sell event pictures, SmugMug was the winner hands down, far and away better than anyother site in that area.
When I started loading stock I went to quite a few sites ( and now there are even more) I chose istock,
also Mathew regarding your previous post about landscape pictures, I only have one or two up and only one DL, This is not to say that your stuff won't sell, it's just not the best market for it. Saddly
I have been 90% in stock since 1974 and license more than 4000 images a year for no less than $175 for one time use. I do not do web use for images. My highest sale was for $12,000. I do not sell $1. I am with over 20 major stock agencies and only sell rights managed images and do not waste my time selling photos for a dollar and think anyone that does really needs to study Business 101. You are being ripped off big-time... It's only 9:30 am todays intake on my end is already $3614.00 from sales on my site and 4 other agents that do provide online stats. I do a high 6 figure net income and am always looking for more outlets to sell. I have 2 full time employees and when not shooting stock I am shooting for corporations around the world. I have over 200,000(unique-not 1000 of the same shot :-) sellable images on file and adding more every day.
If you have stock worthy shots and you're waiting, then you are wasting money.
I started at istock 9-07, with only thiry files uploaded as of now, only 15 of which are getting DL'd with any regularity I broke $800 today. Took my first dissbursement recently and used it to get my wife and I new iPhones. They are sooo cool.
If I was a betting man I'd say stock is not going to happen a SmugMug (I love SmugMug, but it is what it is and it's not a stock site). If Smugmug were to do it, it would have to be a totally different entity, they couldn't just say "come buy stock from our contributers" and stick there name on it.
I am by no means an expert on it, but they can't just tell you to flick a switch in the control panel and you're gallery will be available for stock
If it's Royalty free then there has to be an inspection process for each individual image. They won't be able to have their name on it and assume that you've taken the time to deal with copywrighted or intellectual property issues, and model releases, and they can't put the liability on the contributer because no one would buy with that risk. Then there is the issue of tagging and keywording, if there is no inspection proccess then the searches are rendered worthless. What about plain old quality inspection? is that left to the contributer too? My favorite request in this forum is that everyone want's to set there own price, and the assumption is that microstock equals low quality. 950 DL's = $800 in 8 months on 31files, only 19 of which have been DL'ed at all and only 10 of which with any consistency. So yeah, less than a $1 average, with that there are quite a few iStockers making a living at it.
SmugStock would have to be just that, a totally seperate entity started from scratch, I can't imagine a successfull scenario otherwise.
The bottom line is, if you are interested in getting into stock or even just trying it out, there is no benefit in waiting here. http://istockphoto.com/index.php?refnum=beetle8
Comments
What cure does Smugmug have for Pro users who are getting a little antsy / anxious to get going on the smugstock (or whatever you're going to be naming it?)
Seriously, we all want you to get it right and do not want to sound like I'm rushing you (but can you hurry up
Is there a way to give us a little, tiny, itsy, bitsy hint as to when this is going to come to fusion? Or at the very least, stop leaving us totally in the dark.
Thanks smugmug......
we're getting antsy but, we still love you :-)
Canon AE1 - it was my first "real camera"
Canon 20D - no more film!
We'll announce when we're ready, and no sooner, I'm sorry... I wish I had more to say but I don't
Portfolio • Workshops • Facebook • Twitter
David
Twitter: @WolfSnap
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/WolfSnapDesigns
SmugMug & Wordpress Customization - WolfSnap.com | Custom Domains
No offense in any way, Andy.
You've updated me personally with basically no new information. I wouldn't call that exactly an update but... you DID in fact answer my post. Thank you.
Have a nice weekend, Andy.
Canon AE1 - it was my first "real camera"
Canon 20D - no more film!
Portfolio • Workshops • Facebook • Twitter
I love SmugMug
but it's a different animal
Keith Tharp.com - Champion Photo
I seem to find different ways to ask the same question but, really this time it's different
If you could illustrate to us anxious (but patient) pro users, where on a list of 10 priorities the stock photo site is ( 1 being the highest 10 being the lowest priority) given all the "things" smugmug is updating and getting ready to 'roll out", could you elaborate at least on this, Andy (or ?)
I'm not asking for a release date
I'm not asking what it's going to look like or details regarding it.....
just a 'where on the list of 1-10' you've set this?
Thanks a bunch. We New Yorkers are persistant aren't we?
Canon AE1 - it was my first "real camera"
Canon 20D - no more film!
www.ivarborst.nl & smugmug
Dave
www.ivarborst.nl & smugmug
In prep for the hotly-anticipated feature, I've been designing stock photo processing into my workflow and I need a bit of info from folks familiar with the stock photo market: Specifically, is it worth the hassle to standardize my keyword vocabulary on something like Controlled Vocabulary? Will it in any way improve my chances of being seen by stock buyers? In other words, do stock buyer tend to search on standardized search terms?
image description, duh... I mean..., man,middle aged,vertical,full body,one person,up angle,front,isolated,
these and similiar terms are what are going to be used to narow down the search after they type in football player.
Keith Tharp.com - Champion Photo
I have beel waiting for a long time for this announcement. Looking forward to your email in my mail box!
The only input I have is:
1. A Class Act
2. Very High Quality Images
3. At least three or four images sizes
4. Image Keyword Placement
Smugmug Rocks!
Obviously you're going to remain tight-lipped about DATES, so I'm not going to bother prodding. But is there anywhere that we can go to read up on this, this THING, code-name Smugstock, in general? I can't spend the time to read all 7 pages.
I at least want someone to tell me that, given this long wait, the project is going to WORK, (meaning I can actually count on making sales if my images are decent) and that it will be worth my time to organize my portfolios and set keywords and prices, etc.
Better yet, anyobdy who wants to speak up on HOW to price your stock images, and HOW to keyword them, please do so. And, I think this information needs to be collected on a page somewhere, not a 7-page forum thread that is 90% people asking "when"...
I've left my nature photography on the back burner for over a year now because I couldn't figure out how to earn a living off of it. No matter how good I got at MAKING images, I couldn't find the outlets to effectively SELL them...
I'm already diving into selling Fine Art Textures to other wedding / portrait photographers, and I'm having to resort to Google Adwords to get traffic. Come on, Smugmug, you can do it! Woohoo!
Take care,
=Matt=
My SmugMug Portfolio • My Astro-Landscape Photo Blog • Dgrin Weddings Forum
Portfolio • Workshops • Facebook • Twitter
David
Twitter: @WolfSnap
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/WolfSnapDesigns
SmugMug & Wordpress Customization - WolfSnap.com | Custom Domains
Okay see, I dunno about the other forumers here, but "lots of moving parts" is all I need to hear to make me happy. Having been here for almost as long as you have, Andy, I KNOW that Smugmug delivers the goods.
Now, what about assembling a page that can simply sum up what has been said so far, and how we can prepare? Like I said I'm not hungry for dates, I just want to be as ready as I can.
Pricing for example- On some websites you can download high-res images for just a few bucks, on some you can download an almost unlimited amount for just one monthly fee, and then finally on others you have to pay hundreds or thousands for each image.
Personally I can't bring myself to offer a high-res original of my prized nature photos for less than what I'd charge for a 5x7 print, yet nor do I see my images ever pulling hundreds of dollars per licensing sale when they're "lost" in a sea of smugstock where everybody is setting their own prices at whatever they want...
So, what the heck do I do? Just wait for it to debut, and then frantically scope out the other photographer's prices, and set mine so that I'm somewhere in the middle, and just pray for traffic / sales?
Maybe I need to re-read all of Chris' posts in here back towards the beginning to get these answers. But again like I said, a summary page would be nice...
=Matt=
My SmugMug Portfolio • My Astro-Landscape Photo Blog • Dgrin Weddings Forum
SmugMug not only has to provide protection for themselves, but for us (the photographers) as well. And they have to provide some sort of guarantee that EVERY image posted by a S'mugger will be lawful, useable, and original. Without screening every image beforehand, they have to set up a system that holds only the resposible party liable if something DOES go wrong.
Failing to do that would not only jeopardize the Stock Photo idea, but SmugMug in general.
Lawyers tend to milk things, yes... it's in their interest. But good lawyers take their time to be thorough and get it right the first time... and it's a lot less expensive to let them do that than to pay in Court for getting it wrong down the line...
http://smugmug.uservoice.com/pages/17723-smugmug/suggestions/342479-multiple-sub-accounts-w-seperate-passwords
One of the habits that Smugmug has and I love is that they are into a "satisfaction guaranteed" methodology with their customers. Especially in print sales, Smugmug is extremely generous with their policy, and quick to replace / refund people's orders if they are not satisfied.
I can only imagine the great lengths Smugmug's legal team is having to go to right now to continue a very friendly policy while covering a whole new world of Smugmug liability...
=Matt=
My SmugMug Portfolio • My Astro-Landscape Photo Blog • Dgrin Weddings Forum
Landscapes and other pretty pictures don't preform well as stock.
Keith Tharp.com - Champion Photo
Wow, that made it easy for me! Thanks for the tip.
I have pretty much assumed from day one that being a professional nature photographer is dead, unless you're already in it and very well established, or a total prodigy kid with perfect marketing skills to boot. In general people just don't go on the internet randomly to google and buy nature photography prints, nor are they interested in paying the hundreds / thousands that a good nature stock image used to pull for rights-managed OR royalty free licensed use...
Which is why I got into wedding and event photography anyway.
It would be the ultimate career to teach workshops in the high sierras like the Muench's do, but it'll take me decades to get to that point!
Alright, back to work! Got two jobs to deliver today, and two more to shoot! Here's to hoping the REST of you get Smugstock sooner than later... :-\
=Matt=
My SmugMug Portfolio • My Astro-Landscape Photo Blog • Dgrin Weddings Forum
It's already 'later' :-)
I think sooner OR later is what you meant, Matt :-)
I'm sure they are taking their sweet time with this, because they want to get it right the first time. I'm cool with that but the wait is in a word.....
excruciating!
Canon AE1 - it was my first "real camera"
Canon 20D - no more film!
Professional Photographers Association & National Photoshop Professionals Member
www.billpador.com
Regards,
www.photobycate.com
http://photobycate.wordpress.com/
It's been more than a year since this was announced but still hasn't happened. :-(
If your back and forth with lawyers for this long-I suggest you get better lawyers! They sure could be running up the tab.Photoshelter Collection got off the ground in a few months....Is this going to be happening or should I just bite the bullet and load our stock with another service that is already established ?
itsme
I started at istock 9-07, with only thiry files uploaded as of now, only 15 of which are getting DL'd with any regularity I broke $800 today. Took my first dissbursement recently and used it to get my wife and I new iPhones. They are sooo cool.
If I was a betting man I'd say stock is not going to happen a SmugMug (I love SmugMug, but it is what it is and it's not a stock site). If Smugmug were to do it, it would have to be a totally different entity, they couldn't just say "come buy stock from our contributers" and stick there name on it.
I am by no means an expert on it, but they can't just tell you to flick a switch in the control panel and you're gallery will be available for stock
If it's Royalty free then there has to be an inspection process for each individual image. They won't be able to have their name on it and assume that you've taken the time to deal with copywrighted or intellectual property issues, and model releases, and they can't put the liability on the contributer because no one would buy with that risk. Then there is the issue of tagging and keywording, if there is no inspection proccess then the searches are rendered worthless. What about plain old quality inspection? is that left to the contributer too? My favorite request in this forum is that everyone want's to set there own price, and the assumption is that microstock equals low quality. 950 DL's = $800 in 8 months on 31files, only 19 of which have been DL'ed at all and only 10 of which with any consistency. So yeah, less than a $1 average, with that there are quite a few iStockers making a living at it.
SmugStock would have to be just that, a totally seperate entity started from scratch, I can't imagine a successfull scenario otherwise.
The bottom line is, if you are interested in getting into stock or even just trying it out, there is no benefit in waiting here.
http://istockphoto.com/index.php?refnum=beetle8
Keith Tharp.com - Champion Photo
I would love to see that guy's stock portfolio!
=Matt=
My SmugMug Portfolio • My Astro-Landscape Photo Blog • Dgrin Weddings Forum
Well to quote myself, I'm no expert.
However, one of my points seems to be validated in his research, that no other site will except imbedded data for keywording.
Again I'm no expert
When I was looking for a partner to sell event pictures, SmugMug was the winner hands down, far and away better than anyother site in that area.
When I started loading stock I went to quite a few sites ( and now there are even more) I chose istock,
also Mathew regarding your previous post about landscape pictures, I only have one or two up and only one DL, This is not to say that your stuff won't sell, it's just not the best market for it. Saddly
Keith Tharp.com - Champion Photo
eyedo