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The get ready for the new cart thread

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    NWMtnGuyNWMtnGuy Registered Users Posts: 88 Big grins
    edited June 22, 2008
    Baldy wrote:
    I would love to see us add an option for you to hide the button altogether and make the choice for the consumer. But I don't think that's part of this release and my vote for the #1 thing to do after we ship the cart is coupons.
    Yes! clap.gif Do the coupons first, but I would love to be able to force a specific color option for a whole gallery.
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    BaldyBaldy Registered Users, Super Moderators Posts: 2,853 moderator
    edited June 22, 2008
    renstar wrote:
    On this one, there is a spinner for the quantity. But then, there is a button that says "Add Another Item". Now, my educated guess is that this button allows me to add a different product (sized print, mug, cards, etc) of the same photo, but that's just a guess. Perhaps it would be more obvious if I could just click on it and find out (but i cant right now for obvious reasons). So, i guess the point of this is 1) what does it do? 2) can the text be changed to make it clear what it does?
    You guessed right. It brings up this overlay:

    317916451_bcJ87-XL.png

    One of my jobs is to go over wording with a fine-toothed comb, and this is on my radar. There isn't much space and nothing comes immediately to mind that would be clearer without a long sentence, so any suggestions are welcome.
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    BaldyBaldy Registered Users, Super Moderators Posts: 2,853 moderator
    edited June 22, 2008
    NWMtnGuy wrote:
    However, there are a few that I definitely don't want people to see due to specific annotation.
    Is it this one?

    Eeeewww-she-looks-fat.jpg
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    BaldyBaldy Registered Users, Super Moderators Posts: 2,853 moderator
    edited June 22, 2008
    renstar wrote:
    Also, while it can be deduced that the left number is the price for the item and the right number is the price for the total amount ordered, I think some headings or something are needed here. When you have 1 item, it lists the same price twice and it really isn't clear why.
    Honestly, I'd have to see some customer test showing they really did get confused about that before adding more visual elements to compete with the others and add noise. It's true we do this on the add to cart:

    317979773_dWyiY-O.png

    But it doesn't need to have the extra buttons and options on each print. I could be wrong, but I think this fallis into the category of "I may be curious for a second, but I can deduce it quickly and then I know forever."
    renstar wrote:
    Lastly, the link to "change" the item doesn't fit with the rest of the UI. To me, it feels like it should be a similar button.
    Shush. lol3.gif

    BigWebGuy is a perfectionist and it tortures him to ship anything unworthy of Apple. The link is clear just not gorgeous and coupons are more important than delaying to invent a button for this.

    Note to BigWebGuy: Here's Apple's cart. It sucks by comparison. You can't even tell the links are links. Renstar's gonna zip it. Coupons, baby, coupons.

    318038571_s33en-X2.png
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    renstarrenstar Registered Users Posts: 167 Major grins
    edited June 22, 2008
    Baldy wrote:
    Honestly, I'd have to see some customer test showing they really did get confused about that before adding more visual elements to compete with the others and add noise.

    Fine by me, I was just giving you feedback on what I saw. If you don't think it is a big deal, that's fine and I'm not offended or anything. More signal, less noise is always a good thing.

    Shush. lol3.gif
    HAHA, will do. Again, just pointing out what I saw, most of these things are not a big deal to me, but I do tend to be complete when I do things, so I included them.
    Note to BigWebGuy: Here's Apple's cart. It sucks by comparison. You can't even tell the links are links. Renstar's gonna zip it. Coupons, baby, coupons.
    For the sake of my neck (at the hands of the tones of pro's here who want coupons) I will follow Baldy's advice ;)

    -r
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    BaldyBaldy Registered Users, Super Moderators Posts: 2,853 moderator
    edited June 22, 2008
    renstar wrote:
    Lastly lastly, the one photo that does not need cropping has two options for crop, reset and adjust. I think this should probably be "None" and "Adjust", with perhaps "None" changing to "Reset" if an adjustment has been made?
    I think this is a good point. I don't like the button being called reset because on all the other photos it's called none. And I've sat through enough user tests to know that if you call the button one thing in one context and then another in a second context when it really does the same thing in both, you fail.

    Also, I don't like the text that says, "This photo requires cropping." Actually, it doesn't. There is a button that gives you an option not to crop it.

    But like I said, wording is a project for this week.
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    renstarrenstar Registered Users Posts: 167 Major grins
    edited June 22, 2008
    Baldy wrote:
    And I've sat through enough user tests to know that if you call the button one thing in one context and then another in a second context when it really does the same thing in both, you fail.
    I get you, that is probably the engineer in me providing that solution. That sort of thing doesn't bother me, but I'll trust you that it would confuse enough people to make it not the thing to do.

    -r
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    rich56krich56k Registered Users Posts: 547 Major grins
    edited June 22, 2008
    Hi Baldy,

    Great that you're getting feedback prior to release, however, maybe I mis-interpreted the big dgrin discussion over the last day or two... headscratch.gif

    Maybe this be the opportune time to send all the pros (or all customers- at least the pros since this will directly affect all of US) a note to their site / smugmail / whatever is easiest for smugmug to accomplish (you just did it yesterday - albeit after the fact...) mwink.gif


    My main point - besides all the great points made yesterday - is that although dgrin is a great forum - a large number of us 'pro-account' customers (which represent at least a portion of your revenue) - don't check here daily/weekly for news that we really should know - I only stumbled across this due to the photobar situation -

    Did I mis-interpret what was said yesterday - you were half-way there when you said "I better start the 'get ready for the new cart thread' yesterday" - to me the logical conclusion would be to notify all - and truly get a cross section of feedback from the 'smugmug customer' base - which isn't necessarily the same as the 'regular dgrin' participants (not to take anything away from them - they've helped me many times!)


    As of 8:30 p.m. PST there was no notice from SM re: the new cart discussion that we should check out on dgrin... deal.gif

    Thanks again for being the premier photo site on the web,

    rich56k

    You mentioned it in the first sentence of your first post in this thread...so why no notification to your customers? headscratch.gifne_nau.gifheadscratch.gif

    If nothing else think of the reduction of suprised customers after the fact that you (ie: Andy and crew) will have to deal with..mwink.gif
    http://HooliganUnderground.com
    Member: ASMP; EP; NPPA; CPS
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    bwgbwg Registered Users, Retired Mod Posts: 2,119 SmugMug Employee
    edited June 22, 2008
    NWMtnGuy wrote:
    It's not an end-of-the-world issue, but it's a bit of a hassle. I often have several versions of a particular photo on my hard drive (different processing, sharpening, resolution, etc.) and I frequently annotate this information into the filename. It makes it possible to see in the Mac finder or Windows explorer which file is which without needing to open it in another program.

    In the majority of cases I'm not worried if someone sees the filename - it just looks like a string of nonsense. However, there are a few that I definitely don't want people to see due to specific annotation. I suppose I could identify all the files in question, rename them on my computer, and upload them to my account all over again. But I'd rather not. (Hopefully there aren't too many.)

    Sorry I missed any discussion on this. Although I have been uploading photos to SmugMug for years (4000+ photos) it is only recently that I've gotten serious about customizing my site and using it as a sales channel. Suddenly I'm paying attention to these changes a lot more!
    the filenames in the cart will respect your gallery setting. if you have filenames=no for the gallery the photo lives in, filename will not be shown in the cart.
    Pedal faster
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    J AllenJ Allen Registered Users Posts: 359 Major grins
    edited June 23, 2008
    Baldy wrote:
    I agree with that but thought Mike had a point about the tone.

    Who's getting the goods has a twinge of a drug deal going down in Manhattan and you might be knifed if you answer wrong.

    Getting the goods on cheating spouses.

    Maybe Who's the lucky one is just as memorable but without the twinge.

    We'll work on the wording. One thing we hear every day is how glad our customers are that we don't have forgettable corporate writing that gets lost in a sea of sameness.

    I love the E-Mails that come when someone buy's your pictures..."Who loves ya baby"....always makes me laugh.
    -Joe Allen
    My Smugmug Site
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    NWMtnGuyNWMtnGuy Registered Users Posts: 88 Big grins
    edited June 23, 2008
    bigwebguy wrote:
    the filenames in the cart will respect your gallery setting. if you have filenames=no for the gallery the photo lives in, filename will not be shown in the cart.

    Cool! Thanks. Really looking forward to the new cart rollout!
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    BaldyBaldy Registered Users, Super Moderators Posts: 2,853 moderator
    edited June 23, 2008
    bigwebguy wrote:
    the filenames in the cart will respect your gallery setting. if you have filenames=no for the gallery the photo lives in, filename will not be shown in the cart.
    Oooooo, good answer.
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    BaldyBaldy Registered Users, Super Moderators Posts: 2,853 moderator
    edited June 23, 2008
    rich56k wrote:
    My main point - besides all the great points made yesterday - is that although dgrin is a great forum - a large number of us 'pro-account' customers (which represent at least a portion of your revenue) - don't check here daily/weekly for news that we really should know - I only stumbled across this due to the photobar situation -
    It's very important part of our revenue...

    The good news is I have the ability to send the message out to just pros. The bad is it will displace the current message on their home pages, which is the don't panic about the save icon being visible while you're logged in message. The message gets bumped from your home page to the news page, which is read much less frequently, when a new message comes along.

    Since many of our pros shoot all weekend, they won't have a chance to read that message until Monday or Tuesday. We need 'em to see it to keep panic at bay.

    So I'll probably send out a notification about the cart on Tuesday afternoon or so.

    Most people set their email preference to not receive it, because they're tired of being pummeled by spam and don't trust that we won't succumb to temptation and use email to pimp a Mother's Day sale or something.
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    AllenAllen Registered Users Posts: 10,011 Major grins
    edited June 23, 2008
    Baldy wrote:
    ... current message on their home pages, ...
    Just a side note, I very rarely log in on my homepage, almost always it's after
    I'm in a gallery or cat/sub-cat page. Maybe a flag note on the "you'll be taken
    to" page that you have new messages.:D
    Al - Just a volunteer here having fun
    My Website index | My Blog
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    AndyAndy Registered Users Posts: 50,016 Major grins
    edited June 23, 2008
    Allen wrote:
    Just a side note, I very rarely log in on my homepage, almost always it's after
    I'm in a gallery or cat/sub-cat page. Maybe a flag note on the "you'll be taken
    to" page that you have new messages.:D
    Al, it's a thought but it's also feature creep and might keep us from other stuff :( Dunno if Baldy has the mad skillz to make that happen or not. Thanks!
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    OakleyOakley Registered Users Posts: 446 Major grins
    edited June 23, 2008
    - Is this new cart UI the reason why my website has suddenly gone back to the old old cart UI? (If now, perhaps someone can talk to me about that offline).

    - I'm a little confused how the first screenshot presented had photo sizes already selected. What really is the first screen shot after someone
    a. Hits the add photo button
    b. Hits the add multiple photos button.

    - I'm pretty sure you're not taking feature requests - but are is smugmug planning a feature that allows customers to "tag" photos for possible purchase while they are browsing through a gallery?

    - Generally, I love it. But then again, I loved the other update to the cart you made (which I've suddenly lost).

    Best of luck with the release.
    Ryan Oakley - www.ryanoakleyphotography.ca [My smugmug site]
    www.photographyontheside.com [My blog about creating a part-time photography business]
    Create A Gorgeous Photography Website with Smugmug in 90 Minutes [My free course if you need help setting up and customizing your SmugMug site]
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    OakleyOakley Registered Users Posts: 446 Major grins
    edited June 23, 2008
    Baldy wrote:
    It's very important part of our revenue...

    The good news is I have the ability to send the message out to just pros. The bad is it will displace the current message on their home pages, which is the don't panic about the save icon being visible while you're logged in message. The message gets bumped from your home page to the news page, which is read much less frequently, when a new message comes along.

    Since many of our pros shoot all weekend, they won't have a chance to read that message until Monday or Tuesday. We need 'em to see it to keep panic at bay.

    So I'll probably send out a notification about the cart on Tuesday afternoon or so.

    Most people set their email preference to not receive it, because they're tired of being pummeled by spam and don't trust that we won't succumb to temptation and use email to pimp a Mother's Day sale or something.

    Two words --- Google Reader.
    Ryan Oakley - www.ryanoakleyphotography.ca [My smugmug site]
    www.photographyontheside.com [My blog about creating a part-time photography business]
    Create A Gorgeous Photography Website with Smugmug in 90 Minutes [My free course if you need help setting up and customizing your SmugMug site]
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    AndyAndy Registered Users Posts: 50,016 Major grins
    edited June 23, 2008
    Oakley wrote:
    - Is this new cart UI the reason why my website has suddenly gone back to the old old cart UI? (If now, perhaps someone can talk to me about that offline).
    We never changed the cart UI, not recently, Ryan.
    . But then again, I loved the other update to the cart you made (which I've suddenly lost).

    Best of luck with the release.

    It's right here, on your site:

    20080623-bg87fbsx1crpj16pi4y7uh8df2.jpg

    Click "buy this photo" and see?
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    OakleyOakley Registered Users Posts: 446 Major grins
    edited June 23, 2008
    Andy wrote:
    We never changed the cart UI, not recently, Ryan.


    It's right here, on your site:

    20080623-bg87fbsx1crpj16pi4y7uh8df2.jpg

    Click "buy this photo" and see?

    That's pretty weird. Not 20 minutes ago when I checked on my site - I got the old old UI. Now it seems to be just fine.

    headscratch.gif

    Oh well - all's well that ends well.
    Ryan Oakley - www.ryanoakleyphotography.ca [My smugmug site]
    www.photographyontheside.com [My blog about creating a part-time photography business]
    Create A Gorgeous Photography Website with Smugmug in 90 Minutes [My free course if you need help setting up and customizing your SmugMug site]
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    GJMPhotoGJMPhoto Registered Users Posts: 372 Major grins
    edited June 23, 2008
    Cart changes
    First of all, THANKS for the advanced notice!!!! wings.gif

    When you release, would it be possible to also provide a non-branded HTML snippet that we can imbed in an HTML-only page to provide instructions on how to use the new cart? Here's my thought:

    You're going to release a new help page for smug users with instructions on the new cart...but it will have Smugmug branded all over it... So why not structure it as an imbeddable file of non-branded HTML - which you imbed in your Smugmug help page for your purposes, and that we can embed in our own self-branded help pages (with links to our pricing pages, etc.)?

    This would save us the trouble of having to grab screenshots of the new cart and build our own help pages...plus, it has the added benefit of automatically updating should you change the cart (and your help files).

    I had originally asked for this method of providing embeddable files for things like the product description pages - so we can automatically stay up to date with which products are in, out, new, or updated. Help files are a natural extension. With a big change like the cart in the works, what better time to do it than now?

    - Gary.
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    GJMPhotoGJMPhoto Registered Users Posts: 372 Major grins
    edited June 23, 2008
    family guy wrote:
    I love the E-Mails that come when someone buy's your pictures..."Who loves ya baby"....always makes me laugh.

    Something to look at Baldy:

    www.lulu.com - is an on-demand publishing company that I've used. As an author, they allow you to upload the body of an email, which they then use whenever someone purchases your book. There is a default email from Lulu if you don't upload one...and they only allow one per book. But the nice thing is the tone is whatever we choose to set it to.

    I try to follow the regimen of sending an email to each customer who buys from me on Smug...but I'm always weary of sending two emails into a customer's busy inbox when one could do.

    Is this something that can be / is being considered?

    - Gary.
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    AndyAndy Registered Users Posts: 50,016 Major grins
    edited June 23, 2008
    GJMPhoto wrote:

    Is this something that can be / is being considered?

    - Gary.
    Possible, but not until after cart, and coupons ... and a few other things. I'd like a thank-you PRINT to be an option. They get a print, with your customized thank you message on it. thumb.gif
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    AndyAndy Registered Users Posts: 50,016 Major grins
    edited June 23, 2008
    GJMPhoto wrote:
    First of all, THANKS for the advanced notice!!!! wings.gif

    When you release, would it be possible to also provide a non-branded HTML snippet that we can imbed in an HTML-only page to provide instructions on how to use the new cart? Here's my thought:

    You're going to release a new help page for smug users with instructions on the new cart...but it will have Smugmug branded all over it... So why not structure it as an imbeddable file of non-branded HTML - which you imbed in your Smugmug help page for your purposes, and that we can embed in our own self-branded help pages (with links to our pricing pages, etc.)?

    This would save us the trouble of having to grab screenshots of the new cart and build our own help pages...plus, it has the added benefit of automatically updating should you change the cart (and your help files).

    I had originally asked for this method of providing embeddable files for things like the product description pages - so we can automatically stay up to date with which products are in, out, new, or updated. Help files are a natural extension. With a big change like the cart in the works, what better time to do it than now?

    - Gary.
    Wow that's a huge amount of work, we'll see. Can't make any promise Gary :( I worry about trading this off for other features, and also about maintenance. IMO just use Smug's help pages. I used to think otherwise, and quickly learned it wasn't worth it. And my customers just didn't care - I know, because I've asked 'em.
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    GJMPhotoGJMPhoto Registered Users Posts: 372 Major grins
    edited June 23, 2008
    embedable HTML for help files
    Andy wrote:
    Wow that's a huge amount of work, we'll see. Can't make any promise Gary :( I worry about trading this off for other features, and also about maintenance. IMO just use Smug's help pages. I used to think otherwise, and quickly learned it wasn't worth it. And my customers just didn't care - I know, because I've asked 'em.

    Yeah....but then I lose my banner, my nav bar, and my look and feel...also, (and I hate to bring this up again) your help pages (and product description page) have that annoying link to the costs at the bottom of it....the link I try to keep my customers away from as much as possible...I don't seem to have control of turning that off when they branch off into the smug help pages...

    I am a little confused though...why is it more work? They're writing the HTML anyway...just have the smug sections on the top and bottom and embed the middle...then I can have my gmp sections top and bottom and embed the same file (from the same location)...it's actually pretty easy and the then our help files maintain our banners, our nav bar, etc...

    - Gary.
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    AndyAndy Registered Users Posts: 50,016 Major grins
    edited June 23, 2008
    GJMPhoto wrote:
    ...it's actually pretty easy and the then our help files maintain our banners, our nav bar, etc...

    - Gary.
    It's a fine suggestion and if it's easy to do I support it. I'll make sure Anne sees it thumb.gif
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    gblottergblotter Registered Users Posts: 176 Major grins
    edited June 23, 2008
    Baldy wrote:
    Then we ask for shipping address:

    317322796_F2n6i-X2.png

    Seems like this page is relatively spare on content. With other web commerce sites, I usually prefer to enter all the shipping and billing address info on the same page (with the requisite buttons to populate fields from previously saved information). Is there enough screen real-estate to combine the shipping and billing screens to reduce a few steps?
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    mbellotmbellot Registered Users Posts: 465 Major grins
    edited June 23, 2008
    Andy wrote:
    I'd like a thank-you PRINT to be an option. They get a print, with your customized thank you message on it. thumb.gif

    I'm totally with you on this one Andy.

    Like Gary, I'm very cautious about sending out emails that even appear to duplicate what SM sends for fear of being branded SPAM.

    A 4x6 thank you included with the order would eliminate those fears and also allow for a stylish and personal thank you.

    Stretching it a bit further, it would even be nicer to have multiple thank-you prints. Configure which one gets sent out as part of the gallery settings, or (maybe easier) have a global setting but allow an alternate selection during the proof delay process.
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    mickimicki Registered Users Posts: 47 Big grins
    edited June 23, 2008
    ok, I looked through all this and nothing seems to really go WOW to me except some of it might be a bit confusing to my costomers who really just want me to just crop for them.

    MY main issue is the fact that my customers just want to get BACK to the FOLDERS again (sometimes OTHER folders and still have what they have picked still in their cart (sometimes they forget and what they have picked is not actually IN their cart but in the step before their cart).

    I get lost of complaints that it is hard to find the PLACE where it says click BACK to your pictures. In fact I looked for it on the screen captures.



    What I am VERY VERY (yes I said that twice) concerned about is the fact that you are giving the customer the ability to pick TRUE color. Now I don't mind that if I am alowing them to pick it but will "I" be able to prevent them from picking that?

    Please say I can overide that as a PRO!

    I do lots of pictures in post proccessing that I DO NOT want touched by and AUTO COLORING and I will HONESTLY PULL my ACCOUNT HERE!!!!

    This is why I LOVE SMUGMUG! iloveyou.gif

    I put almost all my accounts (minus some of my soccer and hockey pictures) here in TRUE COLOR where my clients do not get the AUTO color like Walgreens or Walmart does. I have already processed this in my way and do not want them messing with it and changing it again.

    SO please say I can over ride it. I couldn't tell. headscratch.gif

    whew...

    just checking

    Ok,

    All I want is the ability to smooth transactions from going back and forth between folder to folder to buy pictures. Simplify. ~ Thank you for listening. ~ micki
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    AndyAndy Registered Users Posts: 50,016 Major grins
    edited June 23, 2008
    micki wrote:

    I put almost all my accounts (minus some of my soccer and hockey pictures) here in TRUE COLOR
    use Proof Delay and you can switch it back, if the customer changes what it's defaulted to. We very highly recommend our Pros make use of our Proof Delay feature.
    Proof Delay allows you to review the order before it's sent to print,
    make corrections and changes to the cropping as well as auto versus true
    color. Best of all, you have the opportunity to totally replace any
    image that is ordered, with your choice of a replacement, still allowing
    you to adjust the crop and color setting after replacing it. For more
    info on this, please see the links below which would eliminate any
    problems in the future:

    http://www.smugmug.com/help/proof-retouch-replace
    http://wiki.smugmug.net/display/SmugMug/Proof+Delay

    where my clients do not get the AUTO color like Walgreens or Walmart does.
    :nah Our Auto Color isn't like those. :nono

    http://wiki.smugmug.net/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=754083
    http://www.smugmug.com/help/too-red

    I recommend our Auto, Micki thumb.gif your last order would have printed even better thumb.gif #621207
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    mickimicki Registered Users Posts: 47 Big grins
    edited June 23, 2008
    Andy wrote:
    use Proof Delay and you can switch it back, if the customer changes what it's defaulted to. We very highly recommend our Pros make use of our Proof Delay feature.
    Proof Delay allows you to review the order before it's sent to print,
    make corrections and changes to the cropping as well as auto versus true
    color. Best of all, you have the opportunity to totally replace any
    image that is ordered, with your choice of a replacement, still allowing
    you to adjust the crop and color setting after replacing it. For more
    info on this, please see the links below which would eliminate any
    problems in the future:

    http://www.smugmug.com/help/proof-retouch-replace
    http://wiki.smugmug.net/display/SmugMug/Proof+Delay
    :nah Our Auto Color isn't like those. :nono

    http://wiki.smugmug.net/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=754083
    http://www.smugmug.com/help/too-red

    I recommend our Auto, Micki thumb.gif your last order would have printed even better thumb.gif #621207

    ha ha ha ~ on AUTO :)

    I do put proof on proof 2 days for SURE! If I'm going to be gone I put things on for more days on active accounts.

    I do lots of PS work on my Weddings and Retirements where I have select color and saturation and stuff where things are all out of whack. Things that auto would make it go blah.

    My daughter does HIGH SATURATION and we both do some of the new styles and high key stuff with color that can be affected by auto color.

    These types of things can be affected. NOW, if you would enable just those specific pictures to be TRUE color than I would have no problem making my other pictures auto. I have ordered pictures on auto and love them. :) I just don't like seperating my pictures in my folders. B&W's and Colors and high Saturations etc...

    I know blah blah blah :) ~ he he rolleyes1.gif
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